Thoughts on this new Illinois law?

I went to several conferences in Chicago many years ago and loved it. Had a hotel right across from Joe's Stone Crab, and Weber's restaurant was just down the block. Great steakhouses too. Museums were great, and went to both Cubs and White Sox games. Just wonderful times, although my wife did a little damage on what should have been called the Millionaire Mile.

Such a shame how leadership can ruin a once-great city. Yet folks keep voting them in.
 
I went to several conferences in Chicago many years ago and loved it. Had a hotel right across from Joe's Stone Crab, and Weber's restaurant was just down the block. Great steakhouses too. Museums were great, and went to both Cubs and White Sox games. Just wonderful times, although my wife did a little damage on what should have been called the Millionaire Mile.

Such a shame how leadership can ruin a once-great city. Yet folks keep voting them in.
Sure there are some nice attractions and for a long time they were able to keep most of the chaos away from them but that ended long ago. As crazy as this sounds but from what I've gathered, when the mob controlled the majority there was a semblance of order. Since they've ran most of them out now the cartels and gangs run show and we all can see how that's going. I know of one precinct where there's a huge drug house directly accross the street, they have banners and signs degrading the police and the whole 9yrds, and the cops can't/won't/ not allowed to do a thing about it.
 
Sure there are some nice attractions and for a long time they were able to keep most of the chaos away from them but that ended long ago. As crazy as this sounds but from what I've gathered, when the mob controlled the majority there was a semblance of order. Since they've ran most of them out now the cartels and gangs run show and we all can see how that's going. I know of one precinct where there's a huge drug house directly accross the street, they have banners and signs degrading the police and the whole 9yrds, and the cops can't/won't/ not allowed to do a thing about it.
A "drug dealer" was moved in across the street from me. Government payed the rent, and he was well protected by the police as a snitch. The neighbors not so much.

Short of neighborhood committees taking care of their own it will continue. Jeff Cooper's comment on teaching predators to fear victims comes to mind.
 
The real problem as I see it is what Winston Churchill realized.

People Sleep Peacefully in Their Beds at Night Only Because Rough Men Stand Ready to Do Violence on Their Behalf.

The current culture wants to change all our rough men into Baby Mommas.......(see attached picture)

We gotta be rough on crime. Not out in fairy land.
 

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I really really enjoyed my hunting years in Illinois. Too bad its got so many other challenges. Its a great state for deer hunting.

Here's one of my adventures there.

 
They are addressing a very real problem in this country but their solution is really stupid and it will backfire horribly. The constitution does not apply to people without money. Only poor people sit in jail. The reality is that a fair trial only applies to those who have the money for their own lawyer. If you are charged with a crime in this country, you are guilty if you can't afford your own lawyer. Public defenders do not make any attempt to prove your innocence. Their job is to get you to confess and take a plea deal. Doesn't matter whether you did the crime or not. Public defenders have way too many clients to put any time into a single client. I personally know someone who had a warrant taken out against them. I know this story because he was a friend of my brother and the incident occurred on my brother's property while my brother was away. The police were called and there was a police report. The police saw no reason to arrest him. The woman at the incident filed a warrant against him claiming that he assaulted her and he was thrown in jail. This person was poor and could not afford bail and he was assigned a public defender. The public defender made no attempt to even find out if he was innocent. They never even pulled the police report of the incident and looked at it. This person refused to plea so he sat in jail for 8 months until the trial. My brother went and pulled a copy of the police report and took it to court. The police report showed that he never assaulted the woman and cleared him of the charges and was free to go after only sitting in the jail for 8 months of his life. As a matter of fact, the woman was the only one to go to jail the night of the incident because she had outstanding warrants. The woman was not charged with making a false report.

No one wants to address the issue because it does not affect them and it costs too much money. Public defenders should be paid more money so that we don't just get bottom of the barrel attorneys as public defenders. There also should be allot more hired. Public defenders can be representing hundreds of clients at the same time. How can anyone get a fair trial if their attorney only has a few minutes a week if that much to defend them? Maybe Illinois is taking the wrong approach. Maybe they should be making it so that people with money can't get bail. If a poor person has to sit in jail until trial, why shouldn't a person with money have to sit in jail until trial also? Maybe the poor person is more likely to run but can you blame them considering the attorney who has been appointed to represent them?

Again, its a really stupid way to address a very real issue and they are probably going to make the situation even worse as a result of the repercussions.
 
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They are addressing a very real problem in this country but their solution is really stupid and it will backfire horribly. The constitution does not apply to people without money. Only poor people sit in jail. The reality is that a fair trial only applies to those who have the money for their own lawyer. If you are charged with a crime in this country, you are guilty if you can't afford your own lawyer. Public defenders do not make any attempt to prove your innocence. Their job is to get you to confess and take a plea deal. Doesn't matter whether you did the crime or not. Public defenders have way too many clients to put any time into a single client. I personally know someone who had a warrant taken out against them. I know this story because he was a friend of my brother and the incident occurred on my brother's property while my brother was away. The police were called and there was a police report. The police saw no reason to arrest him. The woman at the incident filed a warrant against him claiming that he assaulted her and he was thrown in jail. This person was poor and could not afford bail and he was assigned a public defender. The public defender made no attempt to even find out if he was innocent. They never even pulled the police report of the incident and looked at it. This person refused to plea so he sat in jail for 8 months until the trial. My brother went and pulled a copy of the police report and took it to court. The police report showed that he never assaulted the woman and cleared him of the charges and was free to go after only sitting in the jail for 8 months of his life. As a matter of fact, the woman was the only one to go to jail the night of the incident because she had outstanding warrants. The woman was not charged with making a false report.

No one wants to address the issue because it does not affect them and it costs too much money. Public defenders should be paid more money so that we don't just get bottom of the barrel attorneys as public defenders. There also should be allot more hired. Public defenders can be representing hundreds of clients at the same time. How can anyone get a fair trial if their attorney only has a few minutes a week if that much to defend them? Maybe Illinois is taking the wrong approach. Maybe they should be making it so that people with money can't get bail. If a poor person has to sit in jail until trial, why shouldn't a person with money have to sit in jail until trial also? Maybe the poor person is more likely to run but can you blame them considering the attorney who has been appointed to represent them?

Again, its a really stupid way to address a very real issue and they are probably going to make the situation even worse as a result of the repercussions.
I believe everyone should have a fair trial. And our tax dollars would be better spent on making sure even criminals get a decent attorney than
defunding the police to waste the money on corruption and free stuff that politicians want to hand out, and when murderers, rapists, drug dealers are just let go on society, the costs are even higher in the end.

So, I have no problem beefing up public defenders for criminals, vs.
letting them go Scot free and defunding the police.

But if they are convicted, they have to do hard time, no matter who they are, or what color they are, or how much money they do or dont have.

There is no utopia and no nirvana.
There can never be "perfect justice".
But we need to do our best for the best justice that we can provide.

That means punishing those who do wrong and are proven to have comitted crimes. Injustice is feeling sorry for the criminals and turning them loose on another innocent victim.

I'll go for fair trials and fair representation, and fair jail time.
Not no bail, no trial, no jail, no consequences, and no justice for victims.
 
I believe everyone should have a fair trial. And our tax dollars would be better spent on making sure even criminals get a decent attorney than
defunding the police to waste the money on corruption and free stuff that politicians want to hand out, and when murderers, rapists, drug dealers are just let go on society, the costs are even higher in the end.

So, I have no problem beefing up public defenders for criminals, vs.
letting them go Scot free and defunding the police.

But if they are convicted, they have to do hard time, no matter who they are, or what color they are, or how much money they do or dont have.

There is no utopia and no nirvana.
There can never be "perfect justice".
But we need to do our best for the best justice that we can provide.

That means punishing those who do wrong and are proven to have comitted crimes. Injustice is feeling sorry for the criminals and turning them loose on another innocent victim.

I'll go for fair trials and fair representation, and fair jail time.
Not no bail, no trial, no jail, no consequences, and no justice for victims.
I think most people would be for this until they realize the cost. Not are you only talking about increasing the salary of public defenders by probably 50% to make it competitive but you are also talking about multiplying the number of public defenders by 5 or more. Allot of municipalities can't afford it and people aren't willing to pry that money out of there pockets for others especially those that they have no respect for.
 
The end results are predictable and the lack of criminal accountability endangers law abiding citizens ,law enforcement, and the rule of law in civil society itself. They are doing this for a reason that is as plain as the nose on your face and people in this country need to wake up before it it too late.
100% correct!!
 
In this day and age it is likely that there is a clear evidence trail in most crimes. Wrongful or fabricated accusations with filed charges need to have serious consequences to the filer. It circles back to consequences for crimes. There are innocent people that are sitting in jail. It is tragic, but we can't ignore the clear danger of releasing violent and habitual criminals out in society to continue their predatory behavior.
 
They are addressing a very real problem in this country but their solution is really stupid and it will backfire horribly. The constitution does not apply to people without money. Only poor people sit in jail. The reality is that a fair trial only applies to those who have the money for their own lawyer. If you are charged with a crime in this country, you are guilty if you can't afford your own lawyer. Public defenders do not make any attempt to prove your innocence. Their job is to get you to confess and take a plea deal. Doesn't matter whether you did the crime or not. Public defenders have way too many clients to put any time into a single client. I personally know someone who had a warrant taken out against them. I know this story because he was a friend of my brother and the incident occurred on my brother's property while my brother was away. The police were called and there was a police report. The police saw no reason to arrest him. The woman at the incident filed a warrant against him claiming that he assaulted her and he was thrown in jail. This person was poor and could not afford bail and he was assigned a public defender. The public defender made no attempt to even find out if he was innocent. They never even pulled the police report of the incident and looked at it. This person refused to plea so he sat in jail for 8 months until the trial. My brother went and pulled a copy of the police report and took it to court. The police report showed that he never assaulted the woman and cleared him of the charges and was free to go after only sitting in the jail for 8 months of his life. As a matter of fact, the woman was the only one to go to jail the night of the incident because she had outstanding warrants. The woman was not charged with making a false report.

No one wants to address the issue because it does not affect them and it costs too much money. Public defenders should be paid more money so that we don't just get bottom of the barrel attorneys as public defenders. There also should be allot more hired. Public defenders can be representing hundreds of clients at the same time. How can anyone get a fair trial if their attorney only has a few minutes a week if that much to defend them? Maybe Illinois is taking the wrong approach. Maybe they should be making it so that people with money can't get bail. If a poor person has to sit in jail until trial, why shouldn't a person with money have to sit in jail until trial also? Maybe the poor person is more likely to run but can you blame them considering the attorney who has been appointed to represent them?

Again, its a really stupid way to address a very real issue and they are probably going to make the situation even worse as a result of the repercussions.

I'm pretty much in disagreement with most of what you have posted. I spent 20yrs in the courts as a liaison for law enforcement. Most of the public defenders that I knew were hard working, diligent attorneys. Many were very committed to public service and defending those without their own attorneys. In many cases, public defenders would get financial resources to hire expert witnesses or get assistance with complex cases. A public defender's job is not "to get you to confess and take a plea deal", as you have stated.

Do you really believe what you posted; "Maybe they should be making it so that people with money can't get bail"? Non-violent offends who are unlikely to engage in a repeat offence and who are likely to return to court should be released without bail regardless of their financial situation. Bail is a useful tool and the lack of cash bail is putting career offenders back on the streets the very same day they were arrested. How many of them do you suspect will voluntarily return to court and face a multitude of charges that will likely get them incarcerated? By putting them back on the streets, when there is a propensity to continually commit crimes, is just further stacking the deck against them and putting innocent citizens at risk.

NYC Mayor Adams has, himself, been fighting to overturn the no-cash-bail laws in NY. He used many statistics in support of his arguments. The most glaring statistic was that the 10 ten most prolific criminals in NY have committed 500 crimes, yes, just 10 street thugs. Some of those 10 thugs are still walking the streets. Had the system worked, they would have all been in jail long before 50 crimes were committed, never mind 500. It is outrageous what is going on here in NY.
 
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