Swarovski, Zeiss, Leupold, or Meopta?

[pinhead78]

Hi guys,
I'm looking for a scope to sit on my Rem 700 in 308 for whitetail hunting out to 400 yards, but 100-200 is a common shot. I hunt over a swamp, and it gets dark in there well before legal shooting hours. Optical performance is my biggest concern.
Budget is in the $1200 range. I am considering the following scopes:
Swaro Z3 4-12x50 BT-4W
Zeiss HD5 3-15x50 with LTT
Leupold VX-6 3-18x50
Meopta Meostar 4.5-14x50

Illumination is a nice to have, but not necessarily required.
If you were in my shoes, what would you go with and why?

I watch the for sale boards here and elsewhere, and rarely see Swarovski or Meoptas pop up. Someone is always selling a Leupold or a Zeiss, and that could be for various reasons.
I have done several searches and haven't found the info I'm looking for.
Thanks for your help.

 

[gebhardt02]

I would definitely look at scopes with illumination. My reason is that you don't have to use it, but if you are in a dark area already, your reticle could get lost in the clutter during those critical last minute shots. Illumination will allow you to still see your reticle, and if adjusted properly won't wash out the target image.

Kahles makes a superb hunting scope in your price range, with illumination and outstanding optical capability. Yes, I work with Kahles.

Geb

 

[pinhead78]

Which Kahles?
I have a Steiner for a target rifle, but haven't seen any of their hunting scopes. I'm open to using a Kahles or Steiner for my hunting purposes.

Here's a picture of what I mean from mid November.

 

[gebhardt02]

Take a look at the Kahles KXi 3.5-10X50 model. Classic hunting style scope with illumination. KXi 3,5-10x50 :: KAHLES Gesellschaft m.b.H.

Click the "USA Dealers" tab to locate a dealer and find price. One of our dealers, Euro Optic, also carries the Helia 5 line, which have the 5X erector systems. Good luck.

Geb

 

[Rich Coyle]

pinhead78,

Today I compared a VX-6 with a scope which regularly matches my Swarovski z5. The VX-6 was definitely better in low light. Of the scopes you posted, I would go with the Leupold.

 

[Garycrow]

All the scopes you mention are very good, you won't go wrong with any of them. I'd personally go look through them each and make my own decision, any difference is splitting hairs and it'd likely come down to personal preference.

Where I'll differ with some is in the illumination. I don't personally like illumination on a hunting scope, I find it a bit of a gimmick. I prefer a really nice fat reticle like a german #4 instead of an illuminated reticle. A german #4 can be hunted all night and doesn't add the weight and complexity of an illumination system. I don't want to carry around the extra few ounces for an illuminated reticle that I'll likely never turn on during a hunt. Now on a target or tactical style scope where weight isn't an issue then have at it with the illumination, but I don't want it on a hunting rifle. There are better ways to skin that cat in my opinion.

 

[Daveinjax]

I have the 4-12×50 BT 4W and I'm very pleased with it. Illumination is a gimmick and is electronic and will fail eventually. I hunt a lot of swamps in N Florida and S Georgia that are a whole lot darker that that open freaking prarie that you're calling a swamp and I've never had a problem aiming without illuminated reticle or hunting to the echo of legal light. Zeiss erectors are prone to failure and they take their sweet time warranting them. Like 9 weeks the first time , 10 weeks the second time , and 13 weeks for my friends. My friends Zeiss cost him two nice bucks before he figured out that the scope wasn't holding zero.

 

[Killertraylor]

Not sure why you need that much magnification hunting in a swamp? I've had lots of illuminated scopes and have yet to use one on a hunt. I agree with the others - not needed, but an ounce or two is nothing.

I'm a Swarovski slut and you can't go wrong with that Z3 but the Leupold VX6 2-12x50 with firedot would do exactly what you need and provide great low light performance. I have a few VX-6's mixed in with about 35 Swaro's and the VX-6 is easy to switch to. In your price range too with excellent customer service.

 

[pinhead78]

Thank you for the feedback so far. I really do appreciate it.
I have looked through the Z3, HD5, and a VX6 at Cabelas, but that's not real world...which is why I posed the question to people who may have used them in the field. I didn't see much of a difference between the three.
That Swaro is sexy, and I like the Leupold a lot too. The HD5 is on the bottom of my list but I don't have a good reason why.

What looks like An open prairie is very deceiving. Those dark bushes are waist tall and in some spots, up to your lower chest. The deer hang out in the dense Tamarack trees then walk right between the bushes. On the far left they are easy to spot, but in the center and to the right it gets more difficult.
You can see up to 425 yards on the left, anywhere from 125-450 yards in the center, and 375 on the far right.

 

[Fin-addictions]

I own the Leupold VX-6 your looking at in the illuminated reticle. Here's a little test I ran on a hunt in Southern Oregon this year that kinda blew me away.

I've owned and hunted with Swarovski Binos for 15-16 years, and I'm currently using 8.5 EL's. I've never had a scope that would keep up with that glass in the last 15 minutes of daylight. Walking back to my truck right at dark this year I came into a small clearing, maybe 1/2 the size of a football field. I glassed it real quick just to make sure there wasn't a deer in it. Thing is, I probably couldn't have seen one with my naked eyes, as I could barely see well enough through the Binos. It was in reality dark and past shooting light. Just wondering how the scope would perform, I pulled it up, and holy crap, I could see as well or better than through the Binos. I could have taken a shot had there been a deer. That absolutely blew my mind. Still does. And with the illuminated reticle, you can turn the power down low enough that it doesn't blow or overtake the rest of the image. Pretty incredible glass!

The illumination also turns off after 5 minutes, but the second you move the riffle it comes back on. It's a nice feature that let's you set it and forget about it. I have a friend who also has one and he's on his third year of battery life without having EVER turned it off!

 

[pinhead78]

That's great to hear. That is what I was looking for - real world experience with any of these scopes. I would have thought that the Z3 would have beat the VX6, but that may not be the case.

 

[bruce_ventura]

...I'm currently using 8.5 EL's. I've never had a scope that would keep up with that glass in the last 15 minutes of daylight. Walking back to my truck right at dark this year I came into a small clearing, maybe 1/2 the size of a football field. I glassed it real quick just to make sure there wasn't a deer in it. Thing is, I probably couldn't have seen one with my naked eyes, as I could barely see well enough through the Binos. It was in reality dark and past shooting light. Just wondering how the scope would perform, I pulled it up, and holy crap, I could see as well or better than through the Binos. I could have taken a shot had there been a deer. That absolutely blew my mind...

What magnification was the VX-6 scope set to?

 

[Fin-addictions]

I varied the magnification from about 3-8.

 

[Rich Coyle]

That's great to hear. That is what I was looking for - real world experience with any of these scopes. I would have thought that the Z3 would have beat the VX6, but that may not be the case.

I had a similar experience with my VX-6. It blew away one of my other scopes that is very good in low light. I have Swarovski that is suppose to be here in a week or so and will compare it side by side with my Leupold.