Need help with 308 neck sizing problem

[jshelton2006]

I am still fairly new to reloading but this makes no sense to me. Hopefully someone can help. I've been reloading 22-250 for a while now, and recently got a new 308. So i bought a Redding deluxe 3 die set for 308 (Redding #84155) because I wanted to start neck sizing also (I only FL size 22-250, haven't ordered neck die yet).

So yesterday i was out loading some 308 rounds. I FL sized some brass that i had fired out of another 308, and loaded it with no problems at all. Then i grabbed some Hornady match cases that I had just fired the night before out of my 308 which I am loading for (Savage 12 VLP). I wanted to neck size them, so I ran the neck die down to shell holder, then down another 1/4 turn or so, just so it cammed over a little when I pull the arm down, in order to size the whole neck. I sized about 30 rounds this way. Primed them, put powder in, seated the bullet, pulled it out. Checked OAL and it was a little long, so i ran the seater plug down a little and repeated. Checked OAL again and it hadn't changed. Adjusted the seater plug again, repressed, rechecked OAL, and again it was about the same. Started messing with the round and I was able to move the bullet with my fingers. I spun it then pulled it out completely with very little resistance.

So i resized it in the neck die again, with no change in end results. I measured the inside of the neck of the neck-sized cases, and it was exactly .308". No neck tension at all. So I pulled both the FL and NK dies apart and did some measuring. The expander ball in the FL die measures .305", while the expander ball in the neck die measures .308". Obviously the FL die has .003" neck tension, but I am at a loss for why the neck die has none. Am I missing something or doing something wrong? Or is this a quality control issue on Redding's part? I don't have another Redding 3 die set or else i would compare the expander diameters, so if someone else has one handy could you measure and let me know please? I am not going to crimp.

Like I said I'm still fairly new to reloading but I've read countless hours of stuff on it to fully understand before I started and felt comfortable. If I am missing something or doing something wrong, please let me know and explain! I haven't called Redding due to it being the weekend, so I wanted to see if anyone else has an explanation for me. Any help is appreciated, as I'm stumped. Thanks!

 

[budlight]

The expander ball should be .305 in both. I've never come across your problem and the ball/decappers should be interchangeable

 

[jshelton2006]

That's exactly what i thought. Thank you.

 

[budlight]

I came across this on the Redding site. I only use RCBS and Lee


Question: My Type "S" Die will not size the neck of my cases and/or my bullets fall into my case with no neck tension.

Answer: Type "S" Dies require a Bushing to size the neck of the case. Bushings are not included with the Die and are available for purchase separately.



Question: What Bushing do I need for my Type "S" Die?

Answer: There are two methods for choosing the correct bushing. They are as follows:

1) Measure the neck diameter of a LOADED round or a "dummy" round that you've produced with the brass & bullets you plan to use. Now, simply subtract .002 from the diameter you measure to select the correct bushing size.

a. The use of a Micrometer is advised for these measurements but a Dial Caliper may be used if a Micrometer is not available.

b. Measuring a sample (several) loaded rounds and using the average is advisable.

Example:

My loaded rounds measure .300 at the neck.

.300 - .002 = .298

Thus, a .298 Bushing would be appropriate.

 

[jshelton2006]

I am just using the standard dies, they don't require a bushing. That is for the type S dies.

 

[jmitchell135]

I have a none type s die that is still a bushing die. I have a .336 bushing in it.

 

[Mikecr]

The expander actually should not be .305 as that's way too small.
There is nothing wrong with .308 from an expander. Your brass would spring back from this and that's all the 'tension' you ever really have anyway.

You're problem is in downsizing (lack of it), or in over annealing.

 

[jshelton2006]

My dies don't have interchangeable bushings. I understand that the brass springs back a little, but i still don't understand why the expanders are different diameters between the FL and NK dies??? My brass is once fired, I've never annealed any. Could the brass not be very good and not be springing back or something possibly?

 

[jshelton2006]

My FL 22-250 expander ball measures .2225, so has .0015" neck tension. Redding recommends .002" for their type S die bushings. My 308 FL die has .003", and the 308 neck die has zero. Thats what I'm not understanding. I've always heard Redding dies are among the best on the market, so that's why I use them. I would think it would all be consistent. I also don't think I would have a problem with once fired Hornady Match brass, but I guess it's a possibility. Regardless, I don't see how a .308" expander ball gives enough neck tension to hold a .308" bullet. I understand it springs back a little but it obviously isn't enough. I guess I will just give Redding a call tomorrow.

 

[Bill Johnson]

You're looking at all the right things. Sometimes expander buttons are just the wrong size. I've had to reduce the size of a couple to get the neck tension I want although it can be a PITA. The assembly won't chuck up in a drill so you have to disassemble, get a long screw and put the button on it, run down a lock nut. Then you can chuck it up and, using very fine sand paper, reduce the diameter.

In this case, you have good measurements so why not call Redding? I always enjoy talking to the tech reps and many times, they'll take care of the issue for free.

 

[jshelton2006]

I plan on calling them in the morning. Thanks for confirming, I appreciate it!

 

[jmitchell135]

I just looked at my die and it IS a Redding type S. I was mistaken. Did you get yours figured out??

 

[jshelton2006]

Yes I did. I called Redding customer service and they said the .308" expander should be for a .310 caliber bullet and they didn't know how it ended up in my set, but they immediately shipped me the correct expander and some extra decapping pins. Very pleased with their customer service and all the help on here also. Thanks!

 

[dkhunt14]

There is nothing wrong with .003 tension. I like more tension with hunting guns so recoil doesn't move bullets. Also I have seen a lot of guns with better accuracy with more tension. PPC BR guys tune with tension. I also like tofulllength size everytime and bump the shoulders .002 to .001. Almost all benchrest shooters and F-class guys full length size every time. Necksizing for accuracy is myth. Matt