JDJones75, 257 STW information...

Discussion in 'Rifles, Bullets, Barrels & Ballistics' started by Fiftydriver, Aug 25, 2004.

  1. Fiftydriver

    Fiftydriver <strong>Official LRH Sponsor</strong>

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    JDJones75,

    I have rechambered several 25-06 Remington 700 BDLs to the 257 STW with 26" barrels and and they are getting right at 3950 fps with the 100 gr Ballistic Tip and 3650-3700 fps with the 115 gr Ballsitic Silvertips.

    I prefer a 28" pipe but his round will still give you 200 fps over the 257 WBY out of a 26" barrel.

    You will also not have to put up with the Wby double radiused shoulder.

    The Rem 700 is the best action for such a conversion because all that is needed is to rechamber the barrel, open up the bolt face and install a Sako extractor.

    I must warn that a custom barrel is by far the best option for this round as any barrel that will foul even moderately with a 25-06 will really do so with the STW, plus your still dealing with the factory tube so sometimes you get a great shooter, sometimes just a decent shooter.

    It is a bit more of a gamble recutting a factory pipe.

    Good Shooting!!!

    Kirby Allen(50)
     
  2. lynn

    lynn Well-Known Member

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    FiftyDriver
    What is wrong with the Weatherby double radius shoulder?
    Lynn
     
  3. jhilsen

    jhilsen Member

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    Fifty-

    What powder(s) are using in the 257 STW? Thanks.

    Jim
     
  4. Fiftydriver

    Fiftydriver <strong>Official LRH Sponsor</strong>

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    Lynn,

    For a big game round, there is nothing wrong with the Wby shoulder, even as a match round they are ok but I personally feel the conventional shoulder of 35 to 40 degrees will align the bullet more accurately to the axis of the bore then the Wby design.

    I have seen no difference in velocity or powder burns either.

    It may be more of a personal thing but I prefer a conventional shoulder as do many others in the extreme range hunting crowd.

    Good Shooting!!!

    Kirby Allen(50)
     
  5. Fiftydriver

    Fiftydriver <strong>Official LRH Sponsor</strong>

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    JGH,

    I have found Rl-25 and H-1000 are the best performers with the 100 gr bullets. Rl-22 will get good velocities but the load density is pretty poor.

    FOr the heavier 115-120 gr bullets, H-Retumbo has really produced the best combination of velocity and consistancy.

    I like the Hodgdon powders in rounds like this as they are very stable under a range of temperature changes which is a very good thing with a case that will hold 90 gr of powder and shoots a 1/4" bullet.

    There are a host of others that would also work but these are the best three I have tested to date.

    As for lighter bullet, less then 100 gr, I do not recommend them to be used in the 257 STW because they will not produce consistant powder burns and generally the smaller Wby will produce the same velocity with the light weight bullets.

    100 gr is still quite light and will only work its best at near max to max loadings. The 115-120 gr bullets are a much better match to this case but most guys want the extreme speed.

    TO me a 115 gr Partition loaded faster then any factory 22-250 with a 55 gr bullet is pretty impressive.

    I have ordered some 130 gr ULD rebated boattail hunting bullets from Richard Graves who owns Wildcat Bullets and these should really produce some impressive results in the big STW.

    Good Shooting!!!

    Kirby Allen(50)
     
  6. texasdave

    texasdave Well-Known Member

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    Fiftydriver:
    who do you consider a good custom bullet manufacture. I e-mailed North Fork but never heard back from them. I noticed your mentioning Wildcat and I also know nothing of them. Sorry if I posted this in the wrong place but thought i would as as this was your subject.
    Thanks
     
  7. Guest

    Guest Guest

    Thanks Fifty , the barrel to be worked would be a 26" Shilen 1-10 twist , I checked some of the fires cases on a Sinclair concentricity guage and they seem to be very strait so I'm assuming that the chamber is cut pretty strait.
    The deal is that my switch barrel gun is a Savage and its setup for magnums , I was just wanting to be able to swap out the barrel and not worry about the bolt and the mag having to be changed , I'm lazy I guess.
    I would be intersted in seeing what a 100gr Balistic tip would do to a deer at 200yds when launched at near 4000fps. ,I guess that it kinda turns the deer bullets into varmint bullets
     
  8. Fiftydriver

    Fiftydriver <strong>Official LRH Sponsor</strong>

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    Texas Dave,

    I have been in contact with a fine fellow that lives in Canada and runs a business building custom extreme range bullets. He has many very interesting designs including rebated boattails and bonded core hunting bullets.

    Here is his information:

    Wildcat Bullets
    Richard Graves

    phone:780-352-8592
    Email: wildcatbullets@hotmail.com

    I guarantee you willget a response from Richard quickly, great guy and makes great bullets.

    Kirby Allen(50)
     
  9. Fiftydriver

    Fiftydriver <strong>Official LRH Sponsor</strong>

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    JDJones75,

    I only recommend using the 100 gr Ballsitic Tip on deer for shots outside 300 yards and then only for behind the shoulder shots.

    They are great for hunting pronghorn and coyotes at any range if you do not care to save teh pelts on the yotes that is, BIG exit holes. Leaves good blood trails though for tracking [​IMG] !!!

    For deer I like the 115 gr Ballsitic tip or Partition. I will also be testing a 130 gr ULD rebated boattail make by Richard Graves, owner of Wildcat Bullets(wildcatbullets@hotmail.com). This long heavy bullet could really bring this round into the flat out amazing catagory perhaps as the ultimate extreme range deer round.

    Hope to get the 130 gr clipping along at 3500 fps from 28" barrels. We will see.

    Good Shooting!!!

    Kirby Allen(50)
     
  10. Donham

    Donham Active Member

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    Gez, Fiftydriver, my mouth is watering just hearing (reading) your posts, sounds like a great gun...
    Shooting coyotes with this gun would be like shooting Prariedogs with a 22-250, 100 gr at almost 4000 fps
    I can just see a coyote in two pieces... quick humain kills, the 130's seem to be pretty big, would you need a faster twist? or do you think you extreme velocity will stablize them..
    my factory 25-06 will handle the 115 VL's at 3100-3200 fps, with a 1:10, you should be able to go up 15 grans over me with the extra
    400-500 fps ..
    what is your trist?

    scott
     
  11. Fiftydriver

    Fiftydriver <strong>Official LRH Sponsor</strong>

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    Donham,

    THe 130 gr bullet is a bonded core bullet that has a flat base so it is shorter then one would think for a long range bullet design.

    THe STW is driving the 115 gr pills to +3700 fps from 26" barrels and the 100 gr coated bullets to 4000 fps. From 28" barrels youcan add another 100 fps.

    In a 28" barrel the 130's should run at 3500 fps pretty easily and the 140's should be right around 3300 fps. I would imagine the B.C. of the 140 gr ULD would be in the mid 6's but will find out more once I test them.

    IT does have a very long sharp nose profile from what Richard has told me. I think it will be fine for the faster 25 caliber rounds like the Wby and STW.

    The 25-06 may have trouble stabilizing it in a 1-10 twist.

    This bullet is designed for deer hunting and provides a level od sectional density that has not been around for a long time in the 25 caliber rounds.

    Richard is also designing a 140 gr Rebated Boattail ULD bullet for the 25 caliber rounds that I will be testing and evaluating for him when he gets them built.

    Can you imagine the S.D. and B.C. of such a bullet. To be honest I do not feel that the 1-10 standard twist for 25 caliber rounds will handle this bullet even at teh velocities the STW will produce but that surely is not the bullets fault.

    In fact, I think I will be investing in a Pac-Nor 1-9 blank that I will machine just for these bullets.

    Richard Graves is vertainly not above pushing the envelope in bullet design. He is developing some bullets that are simply amazing as well as inovative to say the least.

    He has one design that he is working on now that would offer a 30 caliber bullet with a B.C. comparible to the heavy weight match bullets but with a weight of around 70 gr.

    He reported 3800 fps from a 308 Win with these bullets and 3/4 moa groups.

    I will not giev any details to the specifics of these bullets as they are still in the experimental stage but I will say Richard Graves is a top contributor in bullet manufacturing and his current bullets are state of the art.

    He has been kind enough to get a special sizing die to make his 300 and 350 gr .338" bullets a true .3380" diamter to work perfectly in the tight match .3382" throats where as the Sierra Matchkings run in the .3385" range and pressure problems arise fast.

    If your looking for top quality bullets get ahold of Richard at wildcatbullets@hotmail.com

    He makes bullets for most calibers in some very interesting designs.

    Good Shooting!!!

    Kirby Allen(50)
     
  12. Donham

    Donham Active Member

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    what is your trist?
    ___________________

    Sorry about that, I meant TWIST! I need to slow down..
    Does this guy have a web site... Good to see more big 25 bullets are comming around.
    the 25 bore is much overlooked...
    The guys building the hot 6.5 on 284 caes...
    the same 130 VLD in a 25 bore is going to have better SD/Bc than on in a 26 bore..
    the general is either te 6/284 or 6.5/284..
    The problem with the 6mm is OVERBORE, the 6.5 are more effecient, but the 140's move only about 2900-3000ps..
    give the 24-25-26 bore the same SD/BC, same bullet design, I think the 25 would edge out in that case size...

    scott
     
  13. Fiftydriver

    Fiftydriver <strong>Official LRH Sponsor</strong>

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    Donham,

    He does not have a web page. Just the e-mail address.

    I just spoke with Richard this morning and he is expecting his 140 gr RBT ULD to have a B.C. a bit over .700.

    This will be a most impressive extreme range bullet for the .257" bores. I will be interested to find out what twist will be needed to stabilize it.

    Will report as soon as I have data on them.

    Good Shooting!!!

    Kirby Allen(50)
     
  14. brianwinzor

    brianwinzor Well-Known Member

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    Fifty Driver,
    Thank you for your information on Richard Graves 130 and 140 grain .257 cal bullets, it has certainly roused my interest and got the juices flowing, as I have been an experimenter from way back.(built a 22/284, and other wildcats in 1972)

    I have long lamented the absence of 120+ grain bullets in this calibre, and noted how the 264 calibre has become trendy with the 1000 yard shooter. The the arrival of the 140 - 155 grain match and VLD style bullets from Hornady, Sierra, Lapua, and others has been the main reason for this revival.

    It would be great if he could develop a 130 grain bullet that would work in the conventional 1 in 10 twist barrel, as that would probably initially increase his sales.

    Unless he is using tungsten cores, the 130 and 140 grain VLD style bullets are likely to need a 1 in 9 or 1 in 8.5 inch twist barrel to give best accuracy.

    In my opinion the arrival of .257 cal bullets of 130 grains and heavier, would certainly justify the use of cases with a capacity of 80 to about 95 grains. Obviously cases such as the .257 Weatherby, and your 257STW come into this category.

    I will give Richard Graves a call and have a chat about these and other bullets. I am also looking for someone who will make some .224 bullets in the 85 - 95 grain range for my next .224 Clark, (ballistically similar to your beloved 22/244 AI.) and also some 35 - 40 grain .172 grain bullets for my .17/222 magnum improved.

    I am aware that JLK make a 90 grain .224 cal VLD, but I would like to source bullets of similar weight from another two sources, before I order my barrel with the appropriate twist, as I will not build a rifle around just one bullet.

    The .224 Clark should be able to push the 90 grain bullets out at about 3550 - 3600 fps, as my last .224 Clark, achieved 3735 fps (sideways) with the 80 grain Sierra HPBT out of a 25.25 inch 1 in 10 twist barrel.

    Obviously I will take a keen interest in the progress of your .257 STW. Regards, Brian.