Highest BC, Highest SD, Lowest CD projectiles for ELR

[Deleted member 46119]

We all know BC and SD but it seems like sometimes we loose track of CD, Coefficient of Drag. In our world it is rolled into BC in our firing solutions. I think it's still very important.

Various machined mono metal projectiles are on the market are providing very high BC and they are very very nice.

However, they lack Sectional Density/Coefficient Drag profile as a result of being made from lighter materials and having more total surface area.

GS Custom
Hammer
Cutting Edge

Seem to be leading the battle at the moment.

I have a large number of Hammer's to test but these are hunters.
I have some Cutting Edge. Mostly MTH for testing.

I've been shooting Barnes 50 Cal Bore rider Long Range. My DTC likes them but I have not stretched them out yet. The published BC seems high. I have not found the Litz G7 numbers.

So that is background for the discussion.

Where do we go from here. "Conventional" small meplat long/heavy for caliber projectiles are making progress. I see some limitations. Specifically the pressure wave ahead of the projectile during barrel time. It seems impossible to break certain velocities.

I'll get the ball rolling.

THEIS has shown us the tubular projectile concept. Even the dimensional ratios were included. Although the paper was specific to high velocity light weight, I am more interested in high velocity heavy weight.

Where do you thing advances in projectile will go for ELR?

 

[THEIS]

Hello,

I have some engineers reviewing the tubular projectile experiment as we speak..I think I may "rebirth" that project if from the engineering side the dimensional ratios can be worked down to smaller diameter projectiles. A "heavy" for size tubular projectile made from tungsten, tungsten moly or tungsten copper at about 385gr launched from case similar to the x90MEN might be a step forward.

But in the meantime..I think high density alloy projectiles encased in polymer "shell" is the very near future in terms of strictly projectiles. For example the attached pic is 220gr .308 diameter projectiles with the "size footprint" of a 180gr .308 projectile. Projectiles are being designed "heavy" for caliber to bump up the BC and such BUT they are getting soooo long that they can be hard to stabilize. Which in turn has everyone looking for bigger case capacity to mask the bullet design flaw with MV band aide.
Heavier weight + Smaller projectile "footprint" = Immediate advancement.

THEIS

 

[THEIS]

Hello,

Here is a different "Tubular" projectile design that functions with sabot instead of "pusher" as the .65 caliber functioned with.

THEIS

 

[Deleted member 46119]

Hello,

I have some engineers reviewing the tubular projectile experiment as we speak..I think I may "rebirth" that project if from the engineering side the dimensional ratios can be worked down to smaller diameter projectiles. A "heavy" for size tubular projectile made from tungsten, tungsten moly or tungsten copper at about 385gr launched from case similar to the x90MEN might be a step forward.

But in the meantime..I think high density alloy projectiles encased in polymer "shell" is the very near future in terms of strictly projectiles. For example the attached pic is 220gr .308 diameter projectiles with the "size footprint" of a 180gr .308 projectile. Projectiles are being designed "heavy" for caliber to bump up the BC and such BUT they are getting soooo long that they can be hard to stabilize. Which in turn has everyone looking for bigger case capacity to mask the bullet design flaw with MV band aide.
Heavier weight + Smaller projectile "footprint" = Immediate advancement.

THEIS

You got exactly where I was going with this.

 

[Deleted member 46119]

Hello,

Here is a different "Tubular" projectile design that functions with sabot instead of "pusher" as the .65 caliber functioned with.

THEIS

A .308 tubular projectile design from 1894. How cool is that!

Everything old is new again.

 

[RockyMtnMT]

We were talking about these the other day. Have they been shot? Do they work? When we went through our patent process I had seen them.

Steve

 

[THEIS]

We were talking about these the other day. Have they been shot? Do they work? When we went through our patent process I had seen them.

Steve

Hello,

Have which ones been shot?
Polymer coated tungsten...yes and yes
Tubular projectile..from what I gather it functioned but was on expiremental basis only. Testing results have not been approved for public dissemination due to design "similarities" to the airfoil grenade.

THEIS

 

[RockyMtnMT]

Hello,

Have which ones been shot?
Polymer coated tungsten...yes and yes
Tubular projectile..from what I gather it functioned but was on expiremental basis only. Testing results have not been approved for public dissemination due to design "similarities" to the airfoil grenade.

THEIS

Sorry, I was talking about the tube bullets. I've had my eye on tungsten for quite a while.

Steve

 

[Deleted member 46119]

Sorry, I was talking about the tube bullets. I've had my eye on tungsten for quite a while.

Steve

The great heavy T

 

[Litehiker]

Look at the companies making CNC lathe turned solid copper bullets. These rounds appear to be the ones with the highest BC and lowest CD. Plus they seem to stay supersonic longer than jacketed bullets.

BUT... they usually cost $1.00 or more per bullet. Jus' sayin'...

Eric B.

 

[Deleted member 46119]

Look at the companies making CNC lathe turned solid copper bullets. These rounds appear to be the ones with the highest BC and lowest CD. Plus they seem to stay supersonic longer than jacketed bullets.

BUT... they usually cost $1.00 or more per bullet. Jus' sayin'...

Eric B.

Not always..

Some times, for some games, the price of playing is a little high. For what I want they will be even more expensive.

 

[snox801]

Sorry, I was talking about the tube bullets. I've had my eye on tungsten for quite a while.

Steve

Well Steve get to cutting. Lol would be quite

 

[RockyMtnMT]

Well Steve get to cutting. Lol would be quite

So far what I know for sure is it is price prohibitive. Like 12 times more expensive than copper.

Steve

 

[Litehiker]

Tungsten is even more difficult to work than titanium. I have tungsten tips on my hiking poles for durability in rocky surfaces. It's **** tough material. Usually tungsten is the core material in armor piercing bullets. (Unless you have a private supply of depleted uranium!;o)

The saying "Wears like iron." should be replaced with "Wears like tungsten."

Eric B.