Help with load dev

[Ubetcha]

Being very new at this and having watched at ton of videos, it seems as there are about as many opinions as to how to "PICK THE ONE" load from a load ladder to go with. I immediately want to pick the best group, but others say pick the best ES/SD. Others yet say pick the velocity window you want and tweek the rest. I don't know what my neck tension is and haven't messed with seating depth until I pick the load.

What is your process? Your opinion and a simple answer why, so I can understand your methodology, not to criticize. I don't know, what I don't know yet....

Here's my data. Which would you pick and why? Thanks! Ubetcha

 

[ShtrRdy]

I've been following the process described in the video by Ryan Furman. This is done at 100 yards.

 

[wvbearhunter]

I start 1.5gr below max and work up

 

[just_jon]

I generally look for flat spots in velocity which are commonly referred to as nodes. I see four nodes in your dataset:
1. Between 75.5 and 76.0
2. between 76.5 and. 77.0
3. Between 77.5 and 78.0
4. Between 78.5 and 79.0

Pick the one you like and run an OWC test at 0.2 grain intervals. I would not pay too much attention to ES/SD based on only three shots.

 

[MagnumManiac]

I don't care about velocity, es/sd or anything else until I have data on target.
To get a true data point with a bullet, I start with seating depth with a middle load using a powder of middle burn rate I do not test with. I do rough seating depth at touch, .010" off, .020" off, .030" off, .040" off and .050" off. 3 shots at each depth. Very early on you will see results, then choose the tightest group and do fine testing at .005" above and below the depth you chose, then choose the tightest group depth again. Then you can go .003" either side and see if it opens or tightens. What you are looking for is a stable depth where it does not open, but, possibly change shape.
After this is determined, do all testing at that seating depth using the OCW method, this gives you charge wait that is the most stable and optimal burn.
ES and SD are not important unless you are shooting beyond 600. They also don't guarantee excellent groups due to barrel time differences.
Groups should always be used to determine if a load is working or not, then look at velocity and ES/SD numbers and test groups at 300 and 600.

Cheers.

 

[nksmfamjp]

What kept you from trying a hotter load?

 

[Ubetcha]

What kept you from trying a hotter load?

To be honest, from what I read, I thought I'd hit pressure at the top load we built. I might try hotter and see what happens. I do really want some top shelf brass for my final loads but just wanted to see what we were working with.

How hot have y'all got with H1000 in your system while maintaining accuracy? A couple of my groups were good, but I'm not the greatest group size guy nor bench shooter. Working on that too.

 

[Russ-T]

This is where everyone has their own method.

I would pick only for accuracy. Pick two of the smallest groups next to eachother in charges where the POI doesn't shift, load in between the charge weights and shoot a group to see how it does. The ES/SD wont really matter until you get much farther than reasonable hunting distances.

 

[FEENIX]

I don't care about velocity, es/sd or anything else until I have data on target.
To get a true data point with a bullet, I start with seating depth with a middle load using a powder of middle burn rate I do not test with. I do rough seating depth at touch, .010" off, .020" off, .030" off, .040" off and .050" off. 3 shots at each depth. Very early on you will see results, then choose the tightest group and do fine testing at .005" above and below the depth you chose, then choose the tightest group depth again. Then you can go .003" either side and see if it opens or tightens. What you are looking for is a stable depth where it does not open, but, possibly change shape.
After this is determined, do all testing at that seating depth using the OCW method, this gives you charge wait that is the most stable and optimal burn.
ES and SD are not important unless you are shooting beyond 600. They also don't guarantee excellent groups due to barrel time differences.
Groups should always be used to determine if a load is working or not, then look at velocity and ES/SD numbers and test groups at 300 and 600.

Cheers.

This is where everyone has their own method.

I would pick only for accuracy. Pick two of the smallest groups where the POI doesn't shift, load in between the charge weights and shoot a group to see how it does. The ES/SD wont really matter until you get much farther than reasonable hunting distances.

This!

 

[2labs]

You've already got a flat spot staring at you — 75.9, 76.2, 76.5 all ran basically the same speed (2863/2861/2867). Six fps across six tenths of a grain. I'd load up around 76.2, shoot a couple 3-shot groups to make sure it holds POI, then start messing with seating depth. Don't sweat ES/SD yet — one shot per charge won't tell you anything real there.

Full disclosure, I'm biased here: this exact headache is why I lliterally just built an app called Loadscope (loadscope.app). You import your chronograph files and your target groups and it scores every load across all four things you're wrestling with — group size, velocity flat spot, ES/SD, and vertical dispersion — automatically-, then weighs them together into one best-load call instead of making you pick which metric to trust. It'll build a DOPE card off your final load too, and there's an iPhone companion so you've got it at the bench or in the field. Mac and Windows. I'm the developer so take it with a grain of salt, but your post is the literal reason it exists.

Im currently looking for beta testers who can give good honest feedback.

 

[Ubetcha]

Thanks fellas. I'll give the advise a go and get some loaded up, and report back. Appreciate ya!

 

[Shane Lindsey]

I would load up 10 at 77.5gr.

You have two loads that showed consistent ES and smallest group size between the two.

Might even just load three each at .003" seating depth changes for a few.

 

[Bitteroot]

What is your process? Your opinion and a simple answer why, so I can understand your methodology, not to criticize. I don't know, what I don't know yet....

With the number one objective being to hit what we're aiming at~ I now use a Audette method ( modified to 2 or 3 shots per increment ) which focuses on point of impact stability through a few powder increments firstly.
This style is results driven and eliminates the white noise with numbers and suspect velocity flat spots that may or may not repeat.
It can implemented to any aspect of load work from powder to seating as well as neck tension or primer testing.
I hesitate to even post this stuff simply due to the , this will never work crowd' but if it helps someone than I'm ok with sharing.

 

[Lenny Foffa]

In my HUNTING Rifles i start at lower velocity with the plan to work up to higher velocities as i carefully judge the accuracy of the three shot groups!! Lots of three shot groups!! i just loaded for an old Model 70 from1949 , with original factory barrel,in 300 H and H ! I STARTED with the Nosler Accuracy load ,for 150 grn bullets !! It was IMR 4350 and it developed 3100 fps in a 26 inch barrel!! I was so pleased that this time , the load was so accurate and had more than enough energy for whitetail at extended ranges ! 150 rounds from the bench in 3 shot groups at 100 ;200 ; and 300 yards. changing the CBTO several times, and finally picked one ! It worked perfectly on its first hunt ! 8 point buck about 105 yards! Dead Right there ! Sometimes an ACCURATE load , that offers plenty of energy and Velocity, at reasonable ranges , can become your pet deer load !!If you hit upon that , then you don't need to load hotter and hotter and faster and faster unless you just want too!