Cleaning with patches only

[Randy Tidwell]

I do use brushes. But I am very particular about them. Only use once and then in the trash. At a BR match, I will use one brush for a match. Then trash.

Regarding patches. These are best patchs I've found and use them exclusively! You can order them on line.

 

[gunplt]

My understanding is that it isn't the brush that does the scratching, rather it is the abrasive materials inside the barrel that the brush dislodges and holds as the brush passes down the bore (of course the same could be said for patches). There is only 2 types of cleaning to my knowledge: chemical (solvents) and abrasive. For chemical a combination of polar and nonpolar solvents is typical, and for abrasive most competitive shooters seem to use something similar to JB Bore Paste with Kroil using either patches or felt bore pellets rather than brushes. Also many shooters are not cleaning rifles as frequently as in the past; many waiting until accuracy losses are noted before cleaning. 200 rounds is another common number of rounds I see mentioned as a point when at least minimal cleaning is performed. There is a good thread on snipers hide on the subject of barrel cleaning: https://www.snipershide.com/shooting/threads/the-evolution-of-barrel-cleaning.6497975/ . There is also a discussion on this topic between Brian Litz & Eric Cortina near the beginning of this video . I am not a competitive shooter, and work travel keeps from shooting as much as I would like, but I generally go with occasional cleaning depending on caliber (obviously rimfire requires more frequent cleaning). Predominately I use patches, Boretech products, and JB bore paste. I have yet to try CLR though I have heard good things (though the constituent ingredients in CLR are polar so I would follow it up with a product like Hoppes No 9 or Boretech, or other nonpolar solvents). A quick comment on the nonpolar term: carbon will readily bond with the iron in the barrel and it is a covalent bond (the strongest bond known) and it is my understanding that only nonpolar solvents or abrasion (in the context of barrel cleaning) can break apart covalent bonds. The carbon ring that forms in the throat has been seen as a frequent issue in the newer PRC cartridges and other "overbore cartridges". So this is the reason for my focus on nonpolar solvents as I typically shoot these cartridges, don't clean frequently, and want to minimize the chance of encountering this issue.

 

[Bud LaRoche]

Do you mean Iosso paste?

Yes sorry for my spell check. I don't think it's much of a paste as compared to other "pastes" out there. I'm not one to use paste as the top tier barrel manufacturer doesn't recommend it either in regards to scrubbing with paste goes. I'm no machinist but I'm guessing Losso isn't very abrasive but I'm just a Seasoned Carpenter.

 

[billflangjr813]

Recently as I don't know which brush is which anymore, I've been cleaning with just patches. Haven't seen anything detrimental at all.

Any comments are welcome.

Just didn't want to jam a brush in there, and leave micro scratches.

Then only buy brushes with what they're marked for like 22 , 243, 30 caliber.

 

[30378wbymag]

No, but that sure has done a great job on my shot gun barrels.

and my outboard steering!!!!

 

[RockyMtnMT]

I quit using brass brushes because they give a false copper indication on the patches. I couldn't seem to ever get the copper out of my barrel until I quit putting brass in it!

I forgot to mention, I still use brushes but only nylon. Stiffer the better. Stainless center not bronze or brass. This way I don't get false copper indications.

 

[Rflshootr]

I never could understand how a bronze or nylon brush could scratch a steel surface.

Anyway, as long as I perform regular intervals of cleaning I limit the use of brushes since the cleaning agents work well enough..

Have you ever seen a barrel that was bell mouthed at the muzzle from using a brush too much and pulling it back through the barrel? The wear is actually from dragging the carbon back through. Or, Have you ever seen a brass jag ding/dent a precision crown at 6 o'clock on a barrel? Sharp edged target crowns are very fragile. It happens........more often than you think. I use brushes between relays at matches to speed up the process a bit. About 1 stroke per shot fired.

 

[Rick Richard]

Have you ever seen a barrel that was bell mouthed at the muzzle from using a brush too much and pulling it back through the barrel? The wear is actually from dragging the carbon back through. Or, Have you ever seen a brass jag ding/dent a precision crown at 6 o'clock on a barrel? Sharp edged target crowns are very fragile. It happens........more often than you think. I use brushes between relays at matches to speed up the process a bit. About 1 stroke per shot fired.

I have heard through internet chatter where folks have claimed this. However, It would take a lot of stroking in my experience to deform a barrel surface with ordinary cleaning. Most barrels are shot out and replaced in competition service well before this would ever occur. Just saying.

 

[asd9055]

Nevermind

 

[30378wbymag]

I have heard through internet chatter where folks have claimed this. However, It would take a lot of stroking in my experience to deform a barrel surface with ordinary cleaning. Most barrels are shot out and replaced in competition service well before this would ever occur. Just saying.

Kinda like polishing the paint off of your truck.... I'm sure it could be done, hell they built the pyramid without the wheel but don't think i'd wanna go that far...

 

[Randy Tidwell]

I've seen several barrels damaged with poor cleaning habits.

Barrels are allot softer than most realize.

When pulling a brush back thru thec muzzle, needs to be wet and pulled very slow.

A friend brought me his Cooper 223 to bore scope because it stoped shooting. I accused him of using 60 grit sand paper!

We did a Rockwell hardness test on a Kreiger barrel and a stainless cleaning rod, the rod was allot harder. I only use coated rods, quality bore guide and good brushes.

 

[30378wbymag]

Hardness, Rockwell C for bronze is: 25.0 - 44.0

Crucible Steel 416R Chromium Stainless Steel is 28.0 - 36.0

So, yes if you get a "hard" bronze brush and your barrel is on the softer side you could damage it but MAN that's a lot of elbow grease when a safe combo of chemicals and brushes / patches would "GIT ER DONE"!!!!

 

[Rick Richard]

Hardness, Rockwell C for bronze is: 25.0 - 44.0

Crucible Steel 416R Chromium Stainless Steel is 28.0 - 36.0

So, yes if you get a "hard" bronze brush and your barrel is on the softer side you could damage it but MAN that's a lot of elbow grease when a safe combo of chemicals and brushes / patches would "GIT ER DONE"!!!!

Not looking for an argument since I believe we both agree on the bottom line of the message. But, I believe crucible steel by itself that has not been "treated" or forged thereby not in the hardness spectrum after a barrel is made is not the same. So, your hardness number noted is correct, but does not adequately represent a finish barrel hardness…much harder.

 

[30378wbymag]

Not looking for an argument since I believe we both agree on the bottom line of the message. But, I believe crucible steel by itself that has not been "treated" or forged thereby not in the hardness spectrum after a barrel is made is not the same. So, your hardness number noted is correct, but does not adequately represent a finish barrel hardness…much harder.

Correct, We absolutely agree! I would just never be that judicious on my barrel scrubbing . All steel regardless of hardening process has a HRC rating, even gold and aluminum. I don't know how much carbon is in CS 416R SS, but if it doesn't have enough carbon it'll never get hard... LOL

I wonder thru shooting if the throat changes it's HRC since it reaches quench temperature then air cooled almost like tempering? Would be interesting to find that out....