Gcan

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Sep 29, 2017
Messages
392
819BDA67-E887-4024-A43E-DF67A92672A2.jpeg Im looking for a smith can measure a chamber on an AR barrel and inspect entire barrel. Maybe cast the chamber. Measure it. I’m able do it but I can’t. I need independent exam.
The chamber seems oversized to me. The fluting appears too deep. I think the neck may be over SAAMI spec.
The finish in the chamber looks like it was done without coolant/oil thu a bore scope. Looks like threading, not reaming. The gas port cuts across two lands and a grove.

Been fighting this thing for 8 months.
Barrel maker assures me it shoots. I sent it back. He claims he put it in an upper and it shot sub 1/2 moa and sent it back. He gave me the load used in it. That load shoots 2” for me. Put 100 loads thru it. Apprx 500 rounds. Throws flyers and sideways bullets.

I paid $800 for this thing with a bolt.

Looking for someone who I can pay to look at it and give me written eval.

The two groups on bottom right of green target are from another 224 shooting the same load at top line of green. All the others are that load and others from the barrel in question. I have 12 targets with multiple loads like this one. 6 Different bullets. 4 primers. Three brass. 5 powders. PMII, NF, Leupolds. Mega mono upper, mega billet upper, Aero and Spikes uppers. 4 billet lowers. Four $200+ triggers. I’m at my wits end.

Every now and then I get 3 good rounds and then a sideways or the load won’t repeat.

There are a lot of people with this exact barrel claiming 1/4” groups. HELP
G
 

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ar10ar15man

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that is not likely the bbl
unless it is so thin it heats quickly
3/4 is not impressive
Not really looking for Valkyrie input.
Looking for someone who can look at a barrel regardless of what it shoots.
Ive had this barrel shoot 3 bullets 3/4” and throw the 4th 8”.
 

Gcan

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Sep 29, 2017
Messages
392
that is not likely the bbl
unless it is so thin it heats quickly
3/4 is not impressive
I have a lot of guns I've never not been able to get any of them to shoot sub 1/2 and most 1/8. Even my ARs are all shooters.
This is driving me batty. I want to be able to say, “here it is”.
There are so many things wrong I’m not sure what is the MOST wrong. I think the fluting is far to deep and the barrel is moving with every shot.
The chamber is terrible. Will post some shots from bore scope.
 

cohunt

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To check the chamber, get a set of chamber gauges.
"In spec" chamber will not close on a field gauge.

How does the crown look?

Paying for a 3rd party evaluation is just going to cost you $, if you already sent it back to manufacturer and they said "its good"

Does the chamber leave Mark's on the brass? It may just need a light hone job.

Did you buy the bolt and barrel together from same manufacture?


Are you dealing with the barrel manufacture or a dealer or smith?

Iirc, there were some "spec" issues with twist rates, throat/jtl inconsistencies with the val. What are your barrel specs? Have you tried factory ammo to rule out reloading practices? Have you had someone else shoot it that has proven accuracy? Is it over gassed? Over gassed will cause issues with accuracy

Lots of things to figure out so we will need more info to try to troubleshoot.
 
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Gcan

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Sep 29, 2017
Messages
392
To check the chamber, get a set of chamber gauges.
"In spec" chamber will not close on a field gauge.

How does the crown look?

Paying for a 3rd party evaluation is just going to cost you $, if you already sent it back to manufacturer and they said "its good"

Does the chamber leave Mark's on the brass? It may just need a light hone job.

Did you buy the bolt and barrel together from same manufacture?


Are you dealing with the barrel manufacture or a dealer or smith?

Iirc, there were some "spec" issues with twist rates, throat/jtl inconsistencies with the val. What are your barrel specs? Have you tried factory ammo to rule out reloading practices? Have you had someone else shoot it that has proven accuracy? Is it over gassed? Over gassed will cause issues with accuracy

Lots of things to figure out so we will need more info to try to troubleshoot.
 

Gcan

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Joined
Sep 29, 2017
Messages
392
I will try to answer in order. First I build bolt guns. I could do this but I need a disinterested third party. I understand the money. That is not an issue for me.

Barrel, gas block and bolt purchased together from smith.

The crown looks good but threaded. I would have done it differently. Have tried various breaks/caps and cans.

In my opinion, the chamber is a mess. Would never get out of my shop. Scoped 5 other ar barrels. This one is by far the most expensive and also the worst. Looks like it was cut with a boring bar. I’m going to post picts this morning. The brass is coming off the cases and actually filling in the grooves in the chamber wall. The fired brass appears to be growing way too much in OD and neck. Oblong in some places. Straight where it should be tapered.

I’m dealing with the smith. It’s a Bartlein blank. I’m not going to call him a liar. I sent the barrel back. He claims his guy shot it with 95 SMKs , Varget, Starline Brass, 2.260 OA and Rem 6-1/2 and it shot sub 1/2”. Ive exactly duplicated that load at least 5 times. Added a 10th. Subtracted a 10th. 2.270/2.280/2.290/2.298. Have shot 69, 70, 75, 80 Eld and 80 SMK/ 88 eld, 90&95 SMK. Not close. Not my first rodeo. I can develop loads. Not getting extreme deviations. Just wont shoot. and when it shoot three into a clover leaf the 4th is 4” way.
R17, Varget, H380, Win780, 8208XBR, 2000MR.

450, 41, Fed ARM, WSRP, Rem 6-1/2.

Fed, two lots of Starline and Hornady brass.


Thinking I might have bad dies I have shot federal 90 match thru it. Also federal 75 hunting. 2 moa. Shoot same loads out of the two other Valkyries i have. Both shoot factory under 1 moa.

I bought the barrel with bolt and their gas block. +2 port. Port is HUGE like .100. Gas everywhere. Have had many conversations with smith bout gas. I get, “we’ve built 3000 barrels. They all shoot except yours.” Because of that I’m not able to throw the towel in. Its not enough to quit. I have to know why.

I also think the flutes are far to deep. Never seen anything like it. The gas journal was so undersized they blasted it to raise OD. Still leaks gas under block. Smith told me to buy a clamp on block.

I believe the chamber is bad and the barrel is moving. I’m sure the gas is a problem. Understand, I paid $790 for barrel, bolt and block. I have $250 in bullets thru this thing. A hundred hours at minimum plus powder, primers and brass. I cannot just quit now.

As soon as I find my card reader I will post photos
 

Gcan

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Messages
392
3A797B51-2554-4ECD-8C5E-C5218C7F6458.jpeg
99153151-766C-4868-81FD-897B0611613C.jpeg


Above are two other AR chambers.


CD5990EB-3CF0-4174-A15E-34AA5A68738E.jpeg

This is a shot of the Valkyrie chamber wall. It is far worse than it appears.
The shoulder junction is hard to describe. The smith told me he inspected the chamber when I sent it back and found it flawless.

Same magnification on all photos. The V is really that bad throughout.

There are picts of gas port also. My scope is 90 degree so you need to visualize the entire thing. It spans 3/4 of two lands and one groove. Smith did this because the original port was shearing copper so badly the port had filled in with welded copper.

Compare the wall finish to the two other barrels below. One is a 556 other is 300 Blk out from AAC.
 

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Gcan

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CB51E2F7-3E17-4DE3-A5DF-037FDE7F0C04.jpeg


Copper everywhere
 

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cohunt

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Sounds like you may have multiple problems so I wont even start the troubleshooting process.
I'm sorry but know when to say when. Cut your losses and move on.

I did same thing once before on a 308 barrel, 2 years of time- over 1000 rounds,different powders & primers, several types of brass, lots of different bullets, several triggers, different scopes and mounts several different die sets--- I got rid of it, bought a new barrel and life is good

Bartlein does not sell ar15/ar10 barrels, they will sell you a blank but you must profile it, drill has block and journal, chamber, thread, crown, install extension, head space to bolt, flute etc.

So it's most likely not the barrel blank, but the Smith who did the machine work. Bartlein does not even sell bolts or extensions-- too much hassle for them.

You are fighting the Smith who did the work, a Smith is only good if they will stand behind their product.

I'm sure you could find someone who would charge you more $$ to "inspect" your barrel and chamber but will it gain you anything?

Good luck, but I feel you are just digging the hole deeper . Jmo
 

CaptnC

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Sounds like you have tons more experience that I do with the AR style platform, that's why I'm going to ask. With your experience level I'm confident I will get a quality answer!

Have you tried the receiver? I've read on a couple different forums that, that is a cause of fliers.
 

Gcan

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392
Sounds like you have tons more experience that I do with the AR style platform, that's why I'm going to ask. With your experience level I'm confident I will get a quality answer!

Have you tried the receiver? I've read on a couple different forums that, that is a cause of fliers.

This barrel has been in two different Mega Machine Megalithic uppers. A mega billet upper. An Aero upper. A billet Spikes upper and a stag upper from a 6.8spc rifle that shoots 1/4”.
It has been in 2 mega lowers. One Spikes billet lower. A stag lower. An Aero lower. I’m sure I’m forgetting others.

Several $$ triggers. 4-5 bolt carriers.
 

CVCOBRA1

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When you switch the barrel to different uppers are you switching the barrel only or are you switching the barrel along with the gas block and tube with it? I have to agree with you that it is a gas problem. Poorly drilled gas port to me. You didn't say if you have tried different blocks, only that the smith told you too. How does the bolt cycle? Is your brass all ending up in a nice pile? Three in a clover and the forth that far away should show up in the cycling.
 

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