24” Steel vs 24” CF Barrel

[choprzrul]

2 Bartlein (just as an example) barrels of the same length, one traditional steel, and the other with carbon fiber. Whatever it takes, but they weigh exactly the same.

Which is going to be more rigid?

In my mind, the more rigid the barrel, the more it tends towards accuracy? Is there any rigidity to weight advantage for either one?

.

 

[Roughrice]

For Accuracy... (cold bore or short shot strings) no difference.
For Consistency...(due to your comparison of carbon being larger with equal weight)... the carbon may possibly hold for a slightly longer shot string until it gets hot, then it'll move as well.

 

[Wedgy]

If you are shooting strings more than 5 shots I would go with steel as the carbon wrap acts like an insulator and keeps the heat in the barrel

 

[7.62 Gunner]

2 Bartlein (just as an example) barrels of the same length, one traditional steel, and the other with carbon fiber. Whatever it takes, but they weigh exactly the same.

Which is going to be more rigid?

In my mind, the more rigid the barrel, the more it tends towards accuracy? Is there any rigidity to weight advantage for either one?

.

Bartlein uses a #4 blank on their CF barrels so they're very rigid, much more than a Proof.
Anything #3 and up has more than enough rigidity for maximum accuracy potential.

 

[cdherman]

Bartlein uses a #4 blank on their CF barrels so they're very rigid, much more than a Proof.
Anything #3 and up has more than enough rigidity for maximum accuracy potential.

Eh. No.

No one takes a blank and just wraps more carbon fiber around it. To the best of my knowledge, they all turn town the blank and then wrap it. So whatever they start with is somewhat moot. It gets pencil thin at some point. Then it gets wrapped.

Equal weight, carbon fiber is stiffer than steel. Period.

I think however that theoretical concerns are secondary to real world observations. What if there are more internal stresses in one barrel versus another? If you cut that barrel down, it might move just a tad. Maybe cut rifling has less internal stresses? Maybe a little movement is meaningless? So why do people shoot heavy barrels, if movement is meaningless?

On average, I think a CF wrapped barrel is more accurate per unit weight for first shot.

Heat dispersion is a valid issue. I cannot ever believe that a CF wrapped barrel can disperse heat as well as steel. It was sort of claimed by some manufacturers. I think however again its an issue of weight. A CF barrel of a given weight will have a much larger surface area on the outside versus a same weight steel barrel. So the rate of heat dispersion from the surface *might* be better for the CF barrel. But how well does that CF barrel move the heat from internal to external surfaces? Might be cooler on the outside, hot has heck on the inside. Not a good move.....

 

[North Idaho Hunter]

Eh. No.

No one takes a blank and just wraps more carbon fiber around it.

You'd be surprised, not uncommon at all.

 

[Phil Rizzo]

You'd be surprised, not uncommon at all.

Some start with a small contour and just wrap it?
doesn't sound unreasonable really.?

 

[choprzrul]

Eh. No.

No one takes a blank and just wraps more carbon fiber around it. To the best of my knowledge, they all turn town the blank and then wrap it. So whatever they start with is somewhat moot. It gets pencil thin at some point. Then it gets wrapped.

Equal weight, carbon fiber is stiffer than steel. Period.

I think however that theoretical concerns are secondary to real world observations. What if there are more internal stresses in one barrel versus another? If you cut that barrel down, it might move just a tad. Maybe cut rifling has less internal stresses? Maybe a little movement is meaningless? So why do people shoot heavy barrels, if movement is meaningless?

On average, I think a CF wrapped barrel is more accurate per unit weight for first shot.

Heat dispersion is a valid issue. I cannot ever believe that a CF wrapped barrel can disperse heat as well as steel. It was sort of claimed by some manufacturers. I think however again its an issue of weight. A CF barrel of a given weight will have a much larger surface area on the outside versus a same weight steel barrel. So the rate of heat dispersion from the surface *might* be better for the CF barrel. But how well does that CF barrel move the heat from internal to external surfaces? Might be cooler on the outside, hot has heck on the inside. Not a good move.....

Interesting. I really don't know either way and that's why I'm asking

So....if all things being equal, we took 2 identical barrels that weigh 3lbs each, and too 1 pound of steel off of one and added 1 pound of carbon fiber wrap, it would be stiffer than the all steel one? Would the carbon fiber wrap help resist internal stresses when heated from repeated firing compared to the all steel version?

.

 

[cdherman]

The carbon fiber would stiffer per what Proof has always said. It would also be much much larger, since the CF does not weigh much.

As to internal stresses from heat, I don't know that I have read about that. Like I said earlier, my Proof CF barrels (2) both shoot really well, but I don't shoot them fast. The "proof" of a CF barrel is in the shooting, right? (Ie the proof of the pudding is in the eating) If it shoots, then they must be onto something!

I'd hate to have a CF wrapped barrel that just had the CF added to the outside. The muzzle end in particular could not be threaded. But if some of them are doing that, well again if they get accuracy, great.

 

[lancetkenyon]

My CF barrels are lighter than a same size steel barrel. They are all plenty stiff to run suppressors.
All my CF barrels are extremely accurate and consistent. But I rarely shoot more than 3 shots at a time. Maybe 5 shots on my smaller case cartridge rifles. I have shot up to 9 shots in a row with a couple, amd they were easily MOA for bolt action rapid fire. 9 shots, 600 yds, 6" plate. All hits in 1 minute. That is from starting the video, getting down behind the rifle, inserting mag, dialing, shoot 3, mag swap, shoot 3, mag swap, shoot 3, get up and stop video.

 

[BALLISTICJESUS]

The steel will out perform the carbon fiber in every category and twice on Sunday and I shoot both.

 

[7.62 Gunner]

Eh. No.

No one takes a blank and just wraps more carbon fiber around it. To the best of my knowledge, they all turn town the blank and then wrap it. So whatever they start with is somewhat moot. It gets pencil thin at some point. Then it gets wrapped.

Equal weight, carbon fiber is stiffer than steel. Period.

I think however that theoretical concerns are secondary to real world observations. What if there are more internal stresses in one barrel versus another? If you cut that barrel down, it might move just a tad. Maybe cut rifling has less internal stresses? Maybe a little movement is meaningless? So why do people shoot heavy barrels, if movement is meaningless?

On average, I think a CF wrapped barrel is more accurate per unit weight for first shot.

Heat dispersion is a valid issue. I cannot ever believe that a CF wrapped barrel can disperse heat as well as steel. It was sort of claimed by some manufacturers. I think however again its an issue of weight. A CF barrel of a given weight will have a much larger surface area on the outside versus a same weight steel barrel. So the rate of heat dispersion from the surface *might* be better for the CF barrel. But how well does that CF barrel move the heat from internal to external surfaces? Might be cooler on the outside, hot has heck on the inside. Not a good move.....

Check with Bartlein then.. there's a reason why their wrapped barrels are a pound heavier than Proof.
Pound for pound is not a good way to compare barrel stiffness.. However a 24" #3 is only slightly heavier than a Proof CF bull and is stiffer.
Again don't take my word for it do some research