Annealing? How do YOU do it? How often?

[Barrelnut]

Since we are on the subject of annealing is there any merit to anneal virgin brass. I just received a 100 Norma brass
for a future 6mm BR build and would like a few opinions on the subject. TKS

I believe all brass is annealed at the factory. It's part of the process of drawing the case. It's just that some manufacturers, like Hornady and Lapua, don't polish after the final anneal.
There's an old Youtube vid showing Remington brass being made and they are running it through industrial flame annealer at the end!

 

[VenatusDominus]

I anneal before each resizing using an induction annealer I designed and built. For those looking at salt bath annealing, annealing is a function of TIME and temperature and at 750 degrees Fahrenheit, cartridge brass take 1 hour to anneal.

 

[CanisLupus]

AMP ... after every firing

 

[Axl]

What makes amp worth the money is its speed and consistency. I use to the annealeze it works just not as well. Really easy to get inconsistency

Also if annealing didnt work. Amp wouldnt be sold out of 1500$ machines or other companies and also adg peterson lapua and others wouldnt come annealed

All brass is annealed after it is made.
AMP being sold out doesn't prove anything. The only thing that matters are the targets. Glen Kulzer set 8 records at 1000 yards last year, including 20 target Aggregate. That is 100 rounds fired over the season, that went into 5.202" at 1000 yards. He doesn't anneal.

1000 yard record « Search Results « Daily Bulletin

bulletin.accurateshooter.com

 

[Barehandlineman11]

If annealing didnt help there wouldnt be industry for plane and simple. Helps with consistent neck tension and brass life. I didnt say all brass wasnt annealed i just pointed out the three best did

 

[Mikecr]

I anneal before each resizing using an induction annealer I designed and built. For those looking at salt bath annealing, annealing is a function of TIME and temperature and at 750 degrees Fahrenheit, cartridge brass take 1 hour to anneal.

No, it would take a lot of time at that temp to FULLY anneal.
Reloaders do not full annealing, as we need tensile strength to cartridge brass standard.
Only brass manufacturers do full annealing, at various forming stages, followed by work hardening.

The 'process anneal' that WE do takes about 5sec with the bath heating both inside and outside at once.
This recovers grain structure to usable hardness. We are merely stress relieving.

 

[Mikecr]

It is quite effective process for annealing, but....I find it to be dangerous due to the high temps the salt has to be raised to. My son saw me annealing using the salt bath system, he bought me an AnnealEez for my birthday. The salt is at such a high temperature that if there is a mistake or accident of some kind it would be catostrophic if it got spilled onto oneself

You don't think a propane torch on the bench is dangerous?

 

[Rick Richard]

You don't think a propane torch on the bench is dangerous?

Totally agree. A burn is a burn

 

[VenatusDominus]

No, it would take a lot of time at that temp to FULLY anneal.
Reloaders do not full annealing, as we need tensile strength to cartridge brass standard.
Only brass manufacturers do full annealing, at various forming stages, followed by work hardening.

The 'process anneal' that WE do takes about 5sec with the bath heating both inside and outside at once.
This recovers grain structure to usable hardness. We are merely stress relieving.

Yes, I totally agree, but if you look at scientific studies, specifically of cartridge brass, 4 minutes at 800 degrees Fahrenheit produced no visible change in the microscopic grain structure. Based on this study, 5 to 10 seconds at 800F will not produce any change in the brass.

Deformation and Annealing of Cartridge Brass

Copper and its alloys are among the most malleable metals and alloys in existence. Cartridge brass, Cu – 30% Zn, has been used for many years to produce cartridge cases for ammunition due to its superior cold forming characteristics. This article shows the microstructure and hardness of...

vacaero.com

 

[justinp61]

You don't think a propane torch on the bench is dangerous?

Just about everything we do has risks. I wonder what would happen if a drop of sweat dripped into a salt bath?

 

[Mikecr]

Yes, I totally agree, but if you look at scientific studies

While interesting, and different, he's doing some really extreme working of the sample, I guess for contrast.
And certainly I agree that mere stress relieving isn't going to recover that, nor would it be enough for the extreme forming of our cases.
WE only need to recover what WE'VE changed, which is way less.

Truly, we need to be careful with full anneal temperatures, where full annealing is never desired.
While they work (obviously) neither torch nor induction is conservative, due the care needed in timing, so that you don't ruin your brass, including leaching of zinc from the alloy.
Since I haven't had an annealing or annealed case issue while dip annealing since the 70s, it's hard to accept an idea that it does nothing at all.
Pretty sure it's working.

I'm also not sure that Vickers hardness correlates with the hoop tensions we're managing.
Maybe elasticity is more than hardness alone leads to, and so far we don't even have a way to measure what we're really doing.
It's all interesting to me.

 

[Alibiiv]

You don't think a propane torch on the bench is dangerous?

That I didn't say!!! What I said was that the salt bath is a dangerous process. By that I mean that the salt is so hot and if there's spillage of any kind it will be catastrophic!! I got a "drop" of molten salt on a piece of wood, it didn't stop burning for a 1/4 inch. That's a drop. The AnnealEez has a micro propane torch that is held in a metal bracket with a pencil thin flame about an inch long. And if you would like to believe that the salt bath method is the way to go, then by all means that is what you ought to be using. I'm not trying to influence anyone on what to use. The OP asked and I gave an opinion based upon my experience with both processes!!

 

[Barehandlineman11]

Well safety first buy a amp lol

 

[Alibiiv]

Since we are on the subject of annealing is there any merit to anneal virgin brass. I just received a 100 Norma brass
for a future 6mm BR build and would like a few opinions on the subject. TKS

I've never bought Lapua or Peterson brass, only Hornady. I always start from scratch and do a full processing; primer pockets, trim to length, debut case mouth, deburr primer pockets, anneal, resize, mandrel neck size, turn the necks, deburr outside of neck