Tuning Devices?

[eddybo]

I see that Butch Lambert at shadetree engineering is going to be making/selling a muzzle device to theoretically place the "anti-node" or dead spot or whatever at the muzzle to diminish verticle disbursion due to velocity variances. Bill Calfee describes it as stopping the muzzle.

I have been reading about this over on benchrest central with some skepticism, but hey when Bill Calfee, Jim Borden & Jackie Schmidt and others beleive in it enough to start cutting up barrels, there just might be something to it.

I am a newbie to precision shooting and sure that there are folks here that fully comprehend the arguments occuring on that site. I think I have a minimal understanding. I dont guess I have to understand how it works as long as it does work.

What do you guys think about these new devices? Do these tuners have a place in the LRH's aresenal?

I am thinking that maybe the muzzle could be "stopped" (as described by Calfee) for a known specific distance, but that it would probably be a detriment to accuracy over a broad range of distances.

I made the body for one last night and will try and make the weights tonight. If I dont lose a finger on the lathe I should be able to test it next weekend. Most everyone testing them are going to be doing the testing at specific distances. I want to know how they effect POI over a broad range of distances.

 

[BountyHunter]

Lot of work being done on that right now by several people and the issue has not been settled on exactly how they work.

Lynn (from CA) probably has the most experience for 1k shooters and he is working along with some others on redefining the tuner for LR guns.

Should be interesting.

Plus until it is settled on how it does what it does, it probably will not drift over to the LR hunting side.

The accuracy levels are slightly different but it should work for LR.

I have two being built now.

BH

 

[Mikecr]

I think they'll be a hot item over here once a quality system-design becomes available. By system, I mean something atleast matching Browning BOSS.
They'll help in grouping with factory ammo as you would finally have something to adjust for best grouping.
They'll save barrel life in load devolopement for most of us.

I think tuning is still a complete mystery though. It will be a long time before anyone will understand exactly where to set a tuner prior to single cold bore shots under different conditions. Just as it will be a long time before anyone can define an accurate barrel -prior to finishing and testing it.
I'm very glad that experimenters(machinists) are finally working on it.

 

[WildcatB]

Here's a link some test info....
Finite Element Analysis -- Dynamic Analysis of a Light Rifle with/without a tuner.


This guy also has studied fluted vs non-fluted barrel studies:
FEA Barrel Pressure Analysis on a 6PPC Rifle Barrel

In fact, if you look at the links on the left he has lots of interested information about guns, accuracy, and hunting. All which make for good reading.

I was just about to start a tread on this and saw your post... perfect opportunity.

 

[uncleB]

I went to the Cactus Classic last weekend, there were several shooters that had a tuner, the winner and several places behind him did not have a tuner.
A barrel tuner does show promise but is far from being an exact science. From what I saw it is still better to TUNE a load to a barrel than to tune a barrel to a load.
UB

 

[eddybo]

That has always been my thoughts UncleB...but what if they built a tuner that would give you a larger accuracy window for your load. I could have won a lot of stuff if I could have stayed on top of my load....but I lack the experiance. If my gun had a larger more forgiving load window as far as temp and humidity it would help my aggs.
What they are claiming is a muzzle device that is only moved once to tune the barrel. After that you tune your load as usual, but not nearly as much. At least that is my understanding.
I got real frustrated at the SE regionals last year. My guns were really in tune the day before I went to Alabama. Once I got there things went down hill fast and I just couldnt stay on top of the load. I had never seen humidity that low and just didnt know which way to go. By the time I figured it out I was dead anyway. I guess that is why I am so interested in the subject.

 

[eddybo]

Psitmac,
I think I read that they are crediting Varmit Al with a lot of the experimentation leading to the new design.

 

[James Jones]

Eddybo , tuning barrel has been around for a long time the rimfire BR guys have always been into it by way of everything from extravagant precision machined micrometer adjustable ends to wand of rubber bands , I have see guys trim their barrel .050" at a time to try to get a barrel to shoot a load that showed very low ES numbers with realy high velocity , and it did show that the accuracy was affected as the groups both grew and shrunk. Its the same basic idea that Browning uses and its a great idea for guys that don't reload and thats tune the barrel to match the harmonics that the specified load is creating.

This subject has been attacked from many differant ways , from adjustable pressure points in the forend for barrel pressure , adjustable tensioned barrels , guns with fully glued in barrels , barrels bedded with silicone , adjustable nodes on the barrel or in several differant spots , its a vary widely looked at subject and somebody somewhere along the line might stumble accross somthing that will chance target shooting forever , but for the time being look at the guys that hold world records and the tools that they use talk to the "guy" that have been inducted into the BR hall of fame and see what his ideas on it are (though I still can't get my head around his methods and the success he has with them)

But the main thing is if we were content with what got us by we would still be throwing rocks !! so if you think you have an idea then put it to work and test it out never now you could be the next Eddison , Columbus , Magelin or anybody else that changed the world with some crack pot hair brained idea

just a note ,keep your figers and all loose objects away from the lathe chuck , I wacked the **** out of my thumb today and remeber always wear your safety glasses.