Presses

[Trickymissfit]

"(Milek is the regarded father of handgun hunting)."

Mr. Milek would likely regard and suggest Elmer Keith better fits that label.

nope! I loved Elmer, but he was not even in the running for that title. Some folks that shot IHMSA might also fit that bill, but never Elmer Kieth. Milek took hand gun shooting from fifty feet to two hundred fifty yards. But of course his buddy Steve Herrett probably has to share an equale part in that statement. Later we got JD Jones, who has pretty much hunted every animal on this planet with a hand gun
gary

 

[Zep]

marioq - I think you might want to start another thread. That should get you a response, your question just gets lost here. I wish I could help but I am unfamiliar with your issue.

 

[boomtube]

"nope! I loved Elmer, but he was not even in the running for that title. Some folks that shot IHMSA might also fit that bill, but never Elmer Kieth. Milek took hand gun shooting from fifty feet to two hundred fifty yards. But of course his buddy Steve Herrett probably has to share an equale part in that statement. Later we got JD Jones, who has pretty much hunted every animal on this planet with a hand gun"

Well, you referred to 'the father of handgun hunting', not those who took what the "father of" started to longer distances. (That's not mentioning Keith's witnessed 600 yard deer killing shot with an iron sight .44 mag S&W 29.) And you might want to add Lee Jarras of Super-Vel fame to your list of advanced big game pistoleros.

 

[Trickymissfit]

"nope! I loved Elmer, but he was not even in the running for that title. Some folks that shot IHMSA might also fit that bill, but never Elmer Kieth. Milek took hand gun shooting from fifty feet to two hundred fifty yards. But of course his buddy Steve Herrett probably has to share an equale part in that statement. Later we got JD Jones, who has pretty much hunted every animal on this planet with a hand gun"

Well, you referred to 'the father of handgun hunting', not those who took what the "father of" started to longer distances. (That's not mentioning Keith's witnessed 600 yard deer killing shot with an iron sight .44 mag S&W 29.) And you might want to add Lee Jarras of Super-Vel fame to your list of advanced big game pistoleros.

well there was also Elmer's 45LC story (don't remember the distance, but was way out there). That so called 600 yard shot has been talked about for thirty years or more, and I don't believe it. Still he could have done it if you give it some thought. Shooting almost strait down makes it doable, but still highly unlikely when you plug all the data into the equation. Elmer used almost nothing but a cast lead bullet of his own design & shape. Possibly a ballistic coefficient in the high twos (300+ grains). He must have had fifteen feet of holdover to even hit the deer! A .25 B/C @ 2000fps muzzel velocity and a 100 yard zero will have close to 168" of drop! Yet at 200 yards, it's a doable shot (not taking power into thought). I shoot the same basic 250 grain bullet he liked so well at 1750 fps (way faster than he did), and might be good for 150 yards on a good day. But no matter what we all loved that old man to death!

gary

 

[boomtube]

"That so called 600 yard shot has been talked about for thirty years or more, and I don't believe it. "

I do.

Elmer did it earlier but he wrote and I read about it in his column in Guns and Ammo in the latter half of the 1960s, including giving the names of those who had been there when he did it. Of course a lot of gun rag writers immediatly poo-pooed the story (perhaps especially the very pompous expert on all things, Col. Askins, USA, Ret.) and they misrepresented it as something Elmer was boasting about or promoting. The truth was - as it so often is - much different.

The deer in question had been moderately wounded by a hunting client, it ran but stopped at that range. Elmer only had his S&W 29 revolver with him so he used it because he had no confidence he could shoot the client's rifle with sufficent precision. He was almost as surprised as the others when it dropped and they paced off the distance.

The whole point of his story was to prove that the lethal effect of his big semi-wadcutter could do the job a long way out if the target could be hit. He was obviously correct and hitting game at long ranges with big handguns using iron sights was Elmer's specialty.

 

[Trickymissfit]

"That so called 600 yard shot has been talked about for thirty years or more, and I don't believe it. "

I do.

Elmer did it earlier but he wrote and I read about it in his column in Guns and Ammo in the latter half of the 1960s, including giving the names of those who had been there when he did it. Of course a lot of gun rag writers immediatly poo-pooed the story (perhaps especially the very pompous expert on all things, Col. Askins, USA, Ret.) and they misrepresented it as something Elmer was boasting about or promoting. The truth was - as it so often is - much different.

The deer in question had been moderately wounded by a hunting client, it ran but stopped at that range. Elmer only had his S&W 29 revolver with him so he used it because he had no confidence he could shoot the client's rifle with sufficent precision. He was almost as surprised as the others when it dropped and they paced off the distance.

The whole point of his story was to prove that the lethal effect of his big semi-wadcutter could do the job a long way out if the target could be hit. He was obviously correct and hitting game at long ranges with big handguns using iron sights was Elmer's specialty.

It's virtually a mathematical impossibility when you compute the ballistics unless the shot was almost strait downwards. I just figure that Elmer used a different yard stick That I do.
gary

 

[uzi 4 u]

I use a rockchuker. been reloadin with it for ten years. Just gettin started myself I would recommend a master reloading kit. Gives you a really good start. Comes witha reloading manual and everything you need to get started minus a tumbler and media seperator. Like one previous post stated get some good reloading manuals. there a must. If you have any pistols I would load a few rounds of pistol ammo first to just get a feel for reloading. Just my opinion.

 

[Zep]

That's a real good idea regarding pistols first. I started with 38 specials on a Redding T-7 and I get a super accurate cartridge. It has been a good way to break me into metallic reloading.

 

[robin12]

I have been trying different factory ammo.
Hsm makes the burger 168vld and they fly straight and true the problem is that
the fired casing will not eject from the bolt without some serious fighting. Federal power shok has crappy groups but the rounds eject fine. The rifle absolutely hates anything by Winchester.

The local reloaders suggested 67 grains of the h1000 using the 168 vld. they also said Winchester cases and a cci primer.

 

[uzi 4 u]

I have been trying different factory ammo.
Hsm makes the burger 168vld and they fly straight and true the problem is that
the fired casing will not eject from the bolt without some serious fighting. Federal power shok has crappy groups but the rounds eject fine. The rifle absolutely hates anything by Winchester.

The local reloaders suggested 67 grains of the h1000 using the 168 vld. they also said Winchester cases and a cci primer.

If you have access to a good set of calipers measure you OAL of both rounds and write it down. Sounds like a pressure or head spacing issue to me.

 

[robin12]

it is a head space issue. The round that gets jammed is 3.350 coal
Hodgen recommends 3.270 and Berger recommends 3.290

maybe the round is getting jammed into the lands?

 

[uzi 4 u]

it is a head space issue. The round that gets jammed is 3.350 coal
Hodgen recommends 3.270 and Berger recommends 3.290

maybe the round is getting jammed into the lands?

Good possibility of that or the case itself is swelling