Pac-Nor order specs

[PGJPJ]

I asked this same question on the Nosler Forum, but I thought I'd look for some more opinions (although I got some good advise already). I want to shoot 168 grain VLD/ABLR, but would like to keep the door open to heavier bullets. I'd also like to keep the door open to shooting Barns 168 LRX if I want (or Oregon gets the California disease of banning lead).

1. Should I go with the 1:8? Or maybe 1:9 (the 168 gr Barns LRX specifies a 1:8)
2. Flutes, yes/no? I'd want to lighten up the #4 contour barrel if I went with that #3 would probably be OK without.
3. Contour, I don't mind a bit of weight, #3 or #4 Fluted?


Pac-Nor Custom Barrel
Caliber:7mm (.284")
Chamber:280 Remington Ackley
Stainless Steel
Grade: Super-Match
Twist: 5 groove/8" twist
Contour: No. 3
Finished Length: 24
Crown: 11 Degree
Finish: Bead Blasted
Fluting: None
Type: Fitted and Chambered
Action: Remington 700 stainless

This will be primarily a hunting rifle, but I might like to play with steel targets at longer longer ranges.

 

[FEENIX]

IIWY, I'd go with 1:8" esp with the ABLR.

 

[Deleted member 46119]

8 twist
fluted
#4 or light palma

 

[Garycrow]

Do the 1-8 twist if you want to be able to shoot the 168 LRX. Skip the fluting and go #3, #4's too heavy for a carry rifle and fluting's a gimmick.

 

[brentc]

Me personally, I'd go with a fluted #5 because I like the way fluted barrels balance. For non fluted go with 24" non fluted #4 with a 1 in 8 twist. Go with the heaviest contour you're willing to carry for the best long range shootability.

 

[longrangehunterII]

Whatever you do not flute the barrel.... AI did an entire test proving that fluted barrel will not produce better groups then non-fluted barrel and discontinued fluting all their rifles that they sell now.

Shilen Rifles Barrels has never don it, neither has Kenny Jarrett for that matter years and years ago..... why start now unless you made the mistake of ordering too heavy of a barrel? Besides, it should only be done before the rifling is done, so in that case you added stresses to the steel that weren't there before the bore was cut. Save the $$ and put it towards something else you'll need or want.

 

[PGJPJ]

Thanks for the responses! I'm so far hearing there is likely no down side to going with a 1:8 twist barrel.

It kind of sounds like contour and fluting is more of a personal preference. My goals for range are not too extreme. I'm hoping for 6-700 yards for steel/targets, and maybe 4-500 for big game. It doesn't need to be a super heavy F-Class rifle. But I would like enough stability to get good accuracy out to the ranges I'm looking for. Ultimately, this rifle needs to earn it's keep as my open country hunting rifle.

Thanks again guys!

 

[Rich Coyle]

PGJPJ,

Pac-Nor does fluting, but they don't follow the contour of the barrel. There is a company called Twisted Barrel I have heard good things about. I Have a Pac-Nor on order now. They are going to chamber it and thread it for a brake. Then they are going to take the barrel off so I can send it to the get it fluted and salt bath nitrided.

 

[longrangehunterII]

You're on the right track with a fast twist that will help with the newest super heavy bullets coming out for the 7mm. I have a 1:8" on my 300 Norma Magnum which most people might think it too much and short range accuracy will suffer? If that's the case look at this target from yesterday w/ my 300 NM. The barrel is a 27.25" Bartlein 5R in a Remington Varmint Contour, which matched the Sako perfectly. It is not a heavy barrel by any means, but it isn't thin either, but still less then the factory heavy fluted Remington Sendero barrel.

I've owned a 280 AI built by Kenny Jarrett since the late 90's with a 1:9" and the 175's work great, and this is in a hunting weight gun at 9 lbs. Understand that RPM will be no different then any other caliber going the same speed, the fast 6.5's do it all the time with zero issues.

Here's the math: 12 divided by the twist x velocity x 60.

The newer 180's and 190's will really shine with a 1:8" twist barrel. This is nothing new and unlike the .22 calibers using super thin jackets are not the same as these bigger bullets being used today.

You'll notice Len's rifles are not fluted! And for good reason, I've had great barrels that just wouldn't shoot because of fluting put together by some of the very best builders out there. When AI did their testing it was clearly evident that a fluted barrel had a higher percentage of dispersion throughout the study. These guys are perfectionist!

Same thing can be said for Jared Joplin owner of American Precision Arms, or George Gardner at GA Precision, none of his team members use fluted barrels. Fact is they don't work other then "Look Cool" and I don't mean they have any more ability to cool a barrel any more then a round one!

I either sold or removed every fluted barrel I own, and each has shot better because of it.

The target below is a brand new barrel on a Sako TRG-42 in 300 NM. Picture #1 shows the first 11-15 rounds through the gun, and another 3, 16-18 inside that group after I blackened the center open dot black with a sharpie so I could see it better, my eyes are not what they were, I'm 52.

I measured that target, set the scope to zero the load and went to test it. Picture #2 is off the Factory Sako Bipod w/a rear bag on the bench at 100 yards, that's a three shot group in the .1's with a Berger Hybrid 230 going 2900 fps. I went out and pounded some steel after that at 272 yards and 445 yards all first round hits.

If you like the looks of fluting Ok, but fluting will hurt accuracy as the barrel heats up, simple fact. That's not just my opinion, but people that have way more data and testing to back that up them me. After I read all the reports about it is why I tossed those barrels and saved the money for other things....

 

[rcoody]

Thanks for the responses! I'm so far hearing there is likely no down side to going with a 1:8 twist barrel.

It kind of sounds like contour and fluting is more of a personal preference. My goals for range are not too extreme. I'm hoping for 6-700 yards for steel/targets, and maybe 4-500 for big game. It doesn't need to be a super heavy F-Class rifle. But I would like enough stability to get good accuracy out to the ranges I'm looking for. Ultimately, this rifle needs to earn it's keep as my open country hunting rifle.

Thanks again guys!

I like a #3 for a light carry gun. Those skinny barrels can be just as accurate as a bull. They can be a little pickier to load for and start to go away after a few shots when they heat up. For hunting that first cold bore shot is the one that counts.

If you are going to use it mostly for a range gun and don't mind toting a 10# rifle then I would go with as heavy a barrel as you can stand. A heavier gun can be steadier off a rest and the barrel will handle the heat of multiple shots much better

Everything is a compromise

 

[brentc]

I've had Pac Nor flute two barrels for maximum weight reduction and both are fantastic. I've never had precision issues with my fluted barrels. Maybe issues would arise if I was shooting long strings in a tactical match, but for three to five shot groups, or more importantly, the all important first shot, there are no issues.

 

[PGJPJ]

Thanks for the very informative responses! It is very helpful.

can I ask another newbie question? Would there be value in making a dummy round, and send it in with the rifle for throating dimensions? It's not like I'm wanting to load the 195 grn Berger VLD, I think the 168's would be more standard. But would it possibly be helpful?

 

[brentc]

Thanks for the very informative responses! It is very helpful.

can I ask another newbie question? Would there be value in making a dummy round, and send it in with the rifle for throating dimensions? It's not like I'm wanting to load the 195 grn Berger VLD, I think the 168's would be more standard. But would it possibly be helpful?

Straight SAAMI spec will give you the most versatility and loading options. They won't need a dummy round for a standard SAAMI. You don't need a fancy chamber to build an excellent shooting rifle

 

[PGJPJ]

Straight SAAMI spec will give you the most versatility and loading options. They won't need a dummy round for a standard SAAMI. You don't need a fancy chamber to build an excellent shooting rifle

Ok, cool. I'll not worry about it.