Management vs. Trades and Labor questions

[Wag482]

Questions about moving from T and L to Management. I have been on the union side for 20 years and am being offered a Supervisor position. I have worked myself into a niche position to where I am pretty much stuck for the rest of my career or until they shut this place down, forecasted in 10 years. My long term goal is to get off of swing shift and this is the only way I can see it happening down the road. Been working swing for 20 years and its starting to affect my health. It would be a salaried position and pay would be equivalent to my current pay with approx. 700 hours of overtime which is what I usually work every year. So basically, same pay but with 700 hours less overtime. My gut is telling me to do it, but I'm scared to make the jump.
Would be supervising 20-30 personnel and be in charge of entire reservation on nights, weekends and holidays. Has anybody made the leap, and would you do it again? What are the pros and cons?

 

[Kernal1984]

Pros: less hours and for me it was the only way out of weekend work and I get to spend more time with my family. Time is precious and we only get so much.

Cons: grown men in the maintenance department can be some of the biggest babies I've ever dealt with. I get to work this weekend due to a member that was conditionally approved for vacation(guy needed to find someone in another department willing to cover his shift for him to be eligible to be off this weekend) throwing a fit to HR. I chose to step up and work for him this weekend even though he was reminded weekly for the last 6 weeks that he would be working the weekend if he didn't have someone to cover his shift. This person was going to be in the running for a promotion soon ironically for a position with hardly any weekend work.

I don't like charts and graphs, I don't like presenting downtime reports, and I don't like dealing with adult children but overall it was an increase in pay going from 70 hours a week to 50 hours. I'll take another step up this fall and get my hours down to 40 but it is a straight salary position with no overtime compensation where as now I get get straight pay for any overtime hours.

I would do it again for the increase in quality of life outside of work but it's not for everyone. I have 3 people I work with that were previously in my position that either stepped down or took positions in other departments to get out of it. Be ready to accept responsibility for your members actions and often items/actions that are out of your control, everybody loves a scapegoat.

My responsibilities are never cut and dry but it may be where you're at so I would ask for a clear explanation of duties and responsibilities also.

Overall I consider myself blessed even with all the negatives it's fun to watch new guys grow and learn and be able to point them in the right direction. I can still get my hands dirty if I choose to and I get to be involved in the really big breakdowns instead of the nickel and dime day to day stuff. It's the same reason I love hunting so much, quite the challenge sometimes.

Let me know if you have any more specific questions, I'd be happy talk more about it.

 

[HSmithTX]

Unless there was a pension involved that I needed to keep I would not take a management position in a union shop, not with the intention to stay anyway. I would move to another company, having held the title and the higher wage will make moving on to a better job a lot easier so short term taking the position makes a lot of sense. I did field work in union shops for 20 years, the people I met and the things they pulled have 100% soured me on unions. I also met some of the very best people I have known in those union shops, I don't have contempt for all union people, I just won't work in that environment again.

 

[Mark37082]

Just for full disclosure, I have not worked in a union shop. After college I took an operations supervisor position at a financial services company. Leadership positions can be very fulfilling but come with a required different mindset and often go home with you at the end of the day. If you are easily frustrated with dealing with seemingly petty issues or addressing performance issues within the team, this is not the direction I would suggest. However, for long term growth and marketability, it definitely has advantages. Supervisory experience can open many doors that would otherwise be closed in the future. Good luck with your decision and best of success.

 

[dmj]

My personal experience going to management and salaried position. Some Employees can grip a lot and really come up with some off the wall stuff that will leave you standing there wondering where did that come from. You have to treat everyone the same, no favoritism. Which at times just doesn't seem justified. Also being salaried there was no overtime but that didn't mean I didn't put in a lot of extra hours. But maybe that was just me. Would I do it again. Probably. But I will admit there were a lot of headaches. Best wishes to you and I hope it works out for the best.

 

[birddog 68]

I have no experience on the management side but I have seen quite a few try to make the transition both in union and non union shops. Unfortunately they are barely ever able to make the change unless you can decide to become a bung hole. Some shop personnel that you have worked with will expect a easy ride and favoritism.
You make a valid point about swing shifts being very difficult on the body along with the OT but there will be added stress when dealing with production numbers, timelines along with dealing with problem/crybaby employees.
Only you can make the choice but realize it's probably not possible to move back down once you take this step.

 

[lancetkenyon]

If your body is telling you it is time to hang up the tools and grab the computer, do it.

I was a carpenter for a LONG time. Switched to management, and with good field experience, it is a blessing for both you and the company as long as you can do the leadership role. It has more room for advancement too. Both in the current company and others in the future.

A good work ethic goes a LONG way in paving your future. I have been a "company man" for the past 17-20 years. OT as a salaried employee is not part.of the equation. But my reputation with my customers and in my field got me a big promotion to a new company last year. A big hike in salary made me take the job.

 

[VinceMule]

I will second the opinion that your health comes first.

 

[Handymike]

I quit being an employee in 1978. Started my own business, learned alot over the years. Management of unproductive union members is lke herding cats.
IMHO
Mike

 

[LRNut]

I have several friends who went from union to management. Some worked out very well, some not as good. A few were laid off when the facility decided to get rid of shift supervisors. Some took jobs at other locations. One guy I knew was terminated for a screw up that cost the site big time, but ironically, he now works for me. He got experience at three other sites and knows his stuff- I typically hire engineers only for that job, but he is an exception.

Only you can assess the risk of downsizing, but it might happen. But it won't be the end of the world - you likely have options.

I don't know what your skillset is, but here is what I tell people when asked, "Should I go to college?" I tell them unless you are going to study engineering, comp sci, etc., you are better off going into skilled trades UNLESS you want a career in sales. The problem with going to college is this: you think the sun shines out of your butt and it is only a matter of time before they recognize your brillance and you get on the CEO track. The problem is it takes 15 to 20 years before you realize you are destined to be stuck in middle management. By that time, you have a family, financial obligations, etc and it is difficult to start your own business, to say nothing of possessing a skill others are willing to pay you for.

If you go into skilled trades, you realize right away your financial renumeration is essentially capped. If you are ok with that, fine. But if not, you can go out and start your own business.

I use a plumbing company in AZ for my rental properties. The other day the owner said, "I am just a dumb plumber." I said, "Nelson, stop saying that - you run your own business" (and he owns a few investment properties as well). By the way, I just transferred $16,500 to his bank for some major work at one of my properties.

 

[bdlesh]

I quit being an employee in 1978. Started my own business, learned alot over the years. Management of unproductive union members is lke herding cats.
IMHO
Mike

I couldn't agree more! It's bad enough supervising normal people, but union whiners are a whole nother level. I would never work for or hire anyone that is union. It's to much of a hassle and big waste of money. Get paid for what ypu are worth.....not what you have to beg for.

 

[martinakl]

Questions about moving from T and L to Management. I have been on the union side for 20 years and am being offered a Supervisor position. I have worked myself into a niche position to where I am pretty much stuck for the rest of my career or until they shut this place down, forecasted in 10 years. My long term goal is to get off of swing shift and this is the only way I can see it happening down the road. Been working swing for 20 years and its starting to affect my health. It would be a salaried position and pay would be equivalent to my current pay with approx. 700 hours of overtime which is what I usually work every year. So basically, same pay but with 700 hours less overtime. My gut is telling me to do it, but I'm scared to make the jump.
Would be supervising 20-30 personnel and be in charge of entire reservation on nights, weekends and holidays. Has anybody made the leap, and would you do it again? What are the pros and cons?

I'd do it. Don't take your foot of the gas though. Invest those 700 hours in yourself. Leadership books & business classes, with topics like: management, financial literacy, budgeting, excel, coaching. Most important is written and verbal communication skill development. Find a mentor or two. Network with other local leaders. Stay out of the office politics. It's a whole new level of petty gossip and bull-pucky in office environments.

Getting into management will open a lot of doors for you, if you do what 90% of other's won't (invest in yourself). If the 10 year shutdown turns into two years from now, you may have a better chance of landing on your feet. Leadership skills are transferable across industries.

Con's:

• You'll likely lose all your work buddies. Maybe not right away, but eventually. You'll be "one of them." You'll make new friends, so it'll be OK
• Your health could suffer more in a management position. Same diet, with potentially less physical activity/movement will wreck your health. We had a saying at my last job, "sitting all day is the new smoking."

 

[hesse]

What is the difference in the pension and the health care . The other thing is if leave the union and it doesn't go good (scape goat ) you have no one backing you . I understand the swing shift that sucks

 

[dmj]

I wish to add one thing to my comments. While you have received a lot of comments and good advice, you are the one that has to make the call. It's on your shoulders and the decision you make will only be your fault good or bad. The ones it will effect are you and your family. I wish you the best and if you are at all like me you are going to do it just to prove you can. Best wishes and good luck.