IMR 4451 and 7977 Enduron Powders ...

[FEENIX]

I was surprised to see them in my LGS so I grabbed one each to to try. Anyone have any successful load experiences to share, in particular; .270 Win/AI, .300 WSM, .300 Win Mag, and .338 Win Mag.

Thank you in advance for your support and understanding.

Ed

 

[paste]

I recently bought one each of these powders to try in my 300 win mag and my 6.5 x 47 lapua.
here is what i did, now im not saying that the way i did this is the right way but it seems to work for me.
IMR 7977 for the 300 win mag
norma 300 win mag brass w fed 215 primers and 208 A-max seated .025 off the lands. my cartridge length using a Sinclair comparator with 30 cal. insert is 2.860 to the ogive.
i started at 73.3 grs and worked up in .3 grain increments to 76.0 grs.
at 76.0 grains i am not to the point of having a compressed load so i might be able to get a little more in the case but i personally don't like to do compressed loads. at 76.0 grs i have no pressure signs of any sort.
below is what i came up with using my chrony chronograph
i should also note that my rifle has a 28 inch brux barrel with a 10 twist

73.3 grs = 2683 fps
73.6 = 2688
73.9 = 2712
74.2 = 2743
74.5 = 2746
74.8 = 2747
75.1 = 2767
75.4 = 2804
75.7 = 2770
76.0 = 2797

I'm not sure what happened with the 75.4 load but that is what my chrony showed. when i get a chance i plan on starting at 75.0 grs and work as far as i can without compressing or till i start showing pressure
i hope this can help you and like i said before, this is what works for me when i am trying a new powder and im not trying to say its the best
if anyone is interested i did the same process with the IMR 4451 powder in my 6.5x47 lapua for which there is no published data for this powder.

 

[ntg]

Ed,

I too would like to know they perform, mostly in the 270win. I'm got a 270 that I just put together and need to play with powders I have first (RL17, H4831), but want to play with these new powders as well. I'm not jumping on them real fast because around here they're about $4 more per pound than the other powders on the shelf. I'd like to see them for $30 like you've got.

 

[Shane Lindsey]

I too am interested. Have been looking at the 7977 for my 270 with the Matrix bullets.
Waiting for the "jury" to be out on it.
Shane

 

[FEENIX]

paste,

That's a very good start ... thanks for sharing!

Shane/ntg,

Will definitely share what I come up with ... and hopefully soon. Cheers!

Ed

 

[Iron Mike Golf]

Only did a velocity check on back behind the garage. 14 rds from my 338 Win Mag Rem 700 XCR.

Hornady 250 gr Interlock SP-RP, Win brass, Fed LRM primers. Seated .030 off the lands.

66.5 gr IMR 4451 gave me 2701 fps avg, 11 fps SD and 40 fps ES..

 

[Shortmagman]

I worked up a load for my Winchester Model 70 in 270WSM with a 24 inch Bartlein barrel, using 150 Berger VLD's in RP case, 215 primers and 68-70 grains of 7977. With the bullets touching the lands 69 grains gave me an average velocity of 3140 ft/sec.. I was amazed at the velocity witch was more that I was supposed to get with 71 grains. I shot five rounds and at 100 yards and I got a group that was less than 3/4 of an inch.
I was pleased with the accuracy but my extreme spread was not good so I am going to try a different primer and see what happens.

I think that this could be a great powder for the 270WSM and 150 grain bullets.

 

[John hunter]

Most of my guns will not shoot a tight group without some
copper fouling (the 5R doesn't seem to care). For this reason
I've been hesitant to use a CFE powder. Most of these guns are
older sporter barrels but even my Shelin barrel on my AR shoots
better after a few rounds through a thoroughly cleaned barrel.
Does this happen to anyone else?

 

[Blacktail63]

Hogdon's 2015 annual load manual has data and some good articles on them.

 

[8mmmaghunter]

I have had good luck with 4451 in 6mm Rem with 90 gr BT and 7mm Rem Mag with 150 BT. Used same loads as 4350 and RL17.

Was able to achieve 3200 fps with 7mm Mag 150 gr with .6" groups.

6mm Rem was sub .5" groups but velocity was 100 fps slower than rl17

 

[rharfo]

Cabelas in Wheeling had the new powder in stock last Saturday. Picked up the 7977 for my 280 ack and 300 wm

 

[Lefty7mmstw]

Most of my guns will not shoot a tight group without some
copper fouling (the 5R doesn't seem to care). For this reason
I've been hesitant to use a CFE powder. Most of these guns are
older sporter barrels but even my Shelin barrel on my AR shoots
better after a few rounds through a thoroughly cleaned barrel.
Does this happen to anyone else?

they do not kill copper fouling entirely, just slow it a bunch... The rl line of powders has been doing this for a long time without advertising it... the only non cfe rl powder that I know of is rl17...

as to 7977.... my brother and pops are using it in 300win rifles....

 

[EFR]

Feenix: I just posted this in response to a similar question by NavyChief. Hope it helps. Bottom line, I like it so far.

I started work on 4451 for my sons 270 win and 7977 for my 300 RUM yesterday. As a matter of fact, I just returned from Cabelas after buying two more pounds of the 4451 with the same lot number. After what I saw yesterday, IMR 4451 looks like it will be my 270 powder.

Barnes 129LRX, Federal cases, CCI 200:

900' elevation, 82 degrees

55.5 gr IMR 4451: 3062, 3059, 3048. < 3/4" for 3 at 100 yds
60.0 gr IMR 4451: 3082, 3080, 3075. > 3/4" for 3 at 100 yds.

I seat the 129 LRX to mag length in my sons Tikka T3. Looking through my load journal, I have three separate 1 hole (for 3) groups at 100 yds, but the 129LRX at mag length is a solid 3/4-1" combination. 48 gr of Varget is the only more consistent powder in this combination (followed closely by H4831SC), but nothing can touch this speed. Every other powder I have tried is in the 2800-2900 range.

I will be doing a little more load workup, but I think I'll be sticking with IMR 4451 for this gun and bullet.

The IMR7977 showed promise in the 300 RUM (200 gr Berger Hybrid), but I think it is tit for tat with H1000. Yesterday my chronograph showed 7977 to be slightly faster, but my load journal shows H1000 to be faster on another day (same powder lot). My guess is the chronograph (and lighting conditions) are to blame.

Hope this helps.

Erik

 

[FEENIX]

Erik,

Many thanks, it's always nice to have real world information to share with.

Cheers!

Ed