How well does the average big game hunter shoot?

[memtb]

As a competitive shooter, I'd say even experienced folks need to take a look at some of the shots presented. I can't say how many times I've watch the best shooters mis-judge wind. Shooting on flat ground is different than shooting over a draw. You just don't always know what the wind is doing until you send the first shot.

The more I've shot in competitive environments, in different terrain and areas of the country, the more I've restricted my own distance. Competition has increased my short range (300-400 is a chip shot) and decreased my longer range (>500) on animals.

Shooting across a draw can certainly introduce some very high wind velocitie!

Many years ago, the wife and I had a group of elk, with 2 rag horn 6x6's in the group. It was a relatively short shot of only about 200 to 250 yards across a draw. We had a good breeze we're we were at, with no clue how fast across the draw…. But, it must have been pretty darn high.

We picked out our bulls, the wife shot first with my shot immediately after. Both were broadside shots, and we both always go for a behind the shoulder shot on a broadside presentation. We both wounded our bulls, later to find that both bullet impacts were remarkably similar….both gut shots.

Thankfully, both of us shot higher caliber rifles with moderately heavy bullets. Both elk were quite sick from the wounds, and closing on them and finishing them off was pretty easy/uneventful!

To this day, I wonder how fast that wind was to cause that much drift on a short range shot as this! memtb

 

[Ruger4570]

I am a Firearms Instructor at the S.O. Range and we have a Hunter Sight in day every year before hunting season. In addition to that, we have a public shooting day the first and second Thursday of every month. Shooting from sandbags off of a bench, most people can't shoot a three inch group. They come with equipment in awful shape, with a WalMart scope on a 7mm mag that won't group at all. Again, this is off of sand bags off of a concrete bench. A hodgepodge of ammunition, different brands and bullet weights. They shoot as fast as they can chamber another round regardless of what we instruct them to do. A six inch group at 100 yards, and they want to start cranking on the adjustment turrets not having any idea about shooting a "group", then moving the group. They shoot 5 more rounds into a worse group, then crank on the adjustment turrets. At the end of the session, if the shots are anywhere on a sight-in target at 100 yards, they proclaim: "That's good enough". They then throw their rifle into the bed of their pickup and drive away. Most have no ammo left, and say they are heading to Cabelas or WalMart to get more ammo, not realizing they need the same brand and bullet weight they are sighted in with, but realistically wouldn't matter the way they are shooting. Of course we have exceptions to the above where someone will show up with a rifle already sighted in and shoot a nice 3/4 inch group two inches high at 100 yards. BUT that's not very often but it does happen.

I have help at the gun range I shoot at in Texasand this was true. . Pity

 

[parshal]

To this day, I wonder how fast that wind was to cause that much drift on a short range shot as this! memtb

It doesn't take much!

I shot an NRL Hunter team match two weekends ago. My teammate is a wind wizard and shot first at every stage. I remember specifically one stage with four pigs from 450 - 250 strung along a 30 degree swing. Wind was about 7 mph from 5:30 on the first target.

First two targets were right edge, third straight up and the fourth .2 mil right off the target. He was able to figure that out on each target and get first round impacts. I'd have missed at least two if I were shooting first. Those distances aren't far at all and those would have been gut shots for most folks on animals.

 

[scpaul]

We have gotten where we tend to shoot alot of steel, it makes noise so we know we hit, it may move and we dont have to replace it very often, just a quick coat of paint. I think that we should reconsider paper targets out to atleast 300 if not 500yds. It will allow people to see their groups and some problems. I know it's more trouble but I think it would be worth it in the long run especially for youth
to compare and learn from their propensity to make a consistent mistake and maybe compete with each other and some of the "supposed older snipers" and shame them into practicing.

 

[sea2summit]

We have gotten where we tend to shoot alot of steel, it makes noise so we know we hit, it may move and we dont have to replace it very often, just a quick coat of paint. I think that we should reconsider paper targets out to atleast 300 if not 500yds. It will allow people to see their groups and some problems. I know it's more trouble but I think it would be worth it in the long run especially for youth
to compare and learn from their propensity to make a consistent mistake and maybe compete with each other and some of the "supposed older snipers" and shame them into practicing.

I can't speak for everyone but a big part of keeping children interested is keeping it fun. Shooting reactive targets (steel, milkjugs, bowling pins, etc) at distance is a whole lot more fun than shooting paper. Unless they are ready for ballistics/corrections/calls you're probably doing it as the parent anyway and it's pretty easy to see what's going on shooting steel. I get a whole lot of performance with a simple phrase "bet you cant hit XXXX"

 

[C-130 Dude]

Practice, practice more, then some more, and so on at varying ranges.

My dad was a stickler for perfection. He admitted to me once that he never achieved, what he thought to be, a "perfect" shot. He said there was no such thing. However, he always told me that, "no amount of practice will make perfect. But it will tend to improve." That piece of advise has been with me for my 60 years of shooting experience. And no, I have never made a "perfect" shot. Wishing in one hand, sh****g in the other.

 

[bamban]

I shoot about 5600 rounds on average a year. I would say 1K+ of those are between 600-1400.

All to make that ONE shot count when it comes time.

When I was heavy into service rifle competition, I burned up 3+ barrels a year at 10K plus rounds. Lots of our matches are no sighters, except at LR where shooters are allowed 2 per stage.

So, at 6, you lay down, slung up, give it your best wind correction, and go. Elevation wise, easier than hunting, it's all KD.

Like you said, trigger time is paramount.

 

[xsn10s]

I used to train and compete but these days my practice amounts to varmint hunting and some maintenance practice. Still good enough for head shots on chucks @ 533 yards coldbore and possibly a yote at 920 yards. I plan on getting more practice in this year.

 

[bamban]

I used to train and compete

^^ Right there is the proper way to spend time on the range. Make it a training day, instead of a general term "practice"

You go to the range with a plan and after action assessment. Train and train till you can't do it wrong. With a clear understanding what caused a shot not on call. Like I tell the kids we train, I appreciate an 8 on call, than an X not on call. However, there is silver lining on shots not on call as long as it lays down on the waterline. It is an opportunity to asses the cause. Did the coach missed the wind or the shooter jerked it there.

 

[C-130 Dude]

When I was heavy into service rifle competition, I burned up 3+ barrels a year at 10K plus rounds. Lots of our matches are no sighters, except at LR where shooters are allowed 2 per stage.

So, at 6, you lay down, slung up, give it your best wind correction, and go. Elevation wise, easier than hunting, it's all KD.

Like you said, trigger time is paramount.

You are so very right! There is no substitute for trigger time. My trigger time in the past few years has been poor. As such, I find myself way behind the curve in trying to ring put my new Pew. Boy it this humbling! I'm all over the place on target. I think I got the jinks! OUCH!

 

[LRNut]

^^ Right there is the proper way to spend time on the range. Make it a training day, instead of a general term "practice"

You go to the range with a plan and after action assessment. Train and train till you can't do it wrong. With a clear understanding what caused a shot not on call. Like I tell the kids we train, I appreciate an 8 on call, than an X not on call. However, there is silver lining on shots not on call as long as it lays down on the waterline. It is an opportunity to asses the cause. Did the coach missed the wind or the shooter jerked it there.

Agree, but I think the best practice is to wait for a change in the wind and not simply correct a wind miss. Easy to do in CO; not so easy in Arizona, where the wind (at least in the desert) doesn't gust/change direction as much. And I would say ranges carved out of standing trees isn't very good either - for years in MN I had two places I shot long range and both were like this - not very good conditions to practice your wind calls.

I would also say practicing long range on a range that has wind flags might be better than nothing, but not much better.

All that said, it is important to practice other positions as well. Sitting with a sling at 300...standing at 100, sitting with a BogPod at 400, etc. I shoot more rounds at prairie dogs in the summer than anything else - nothing else beats crosshairs on game except competitive shooting.

I did have to laugh about the coyote misses - something about the way they come running in that frazzles you - I shot my last one about 50 yards away but missed one before that from about 70. Elk coming into a call - no problem. Coyotes? Different story.

 

[Rich Coyle]

I Love to shoot my hunting rifles every week. A Hunt is huge big deal to me at my age, and I want my shooting skills to be as accurate and precise as I can make them. For me that means Shoot and Shoot and Shoot some more!!! 120 Rounds prior to the deer hunt each season with my .270 Win, Weatherby Ultralight. Ready for a shot from 100 to 300 yards. in N. Carolina or West Virg . 100 rounds at least, fired from the Short 20 inch barreled 30m-06 ready for a shot from 30 yards to 150 yards in Penn woods. Shooting friends are Happy to hit a 6inch Pie plate at 100 yard's ,4 out of 5 shots is perfect for them. "Thats a dead Deer" . Some times showing ammo from 8 or 9 years ago when K mart was in business. 30-06 Core Lockt $15.99 a box green and yellow box. They love to hunt, they "hate to target shoot and waist ammo" It was true when I worked in the Gun Store, and ammo was cheap and available. Its even worse today that ammo is $60;00 or more, and hard to find. I get tired of preaching the benefits of practice to Guys who shoot a deer every year within 25 yards of the Elevated Box Blind. Sometimes I have to remind myself to just shut up.

They could dry fire to practice. Even when I had a 100 yard range I still did dry fire exercises. You call your hits and misses. Pretty soon there are no misses.

 

[lancetkenyon]

I did have to laugh about the coyote misses - something about the way they come running in that frazzles you - I shot my last one about 50 yards away but missed one before that from about 70. Elk coming into a call - no problem. Coyotes? Different story.

Missed one at about 80, but crushed two at 585 and 888. Freaking dogs come in FAST sometimes! And have really good brakes.

 

[bamban]

Agree, but I think the best practice is to wait for a change in the wind and not simply correct a wind miss. Easy to do in CO; not so easy in Arizona, where the wind (at least in the desert) doesn't gust/change direction as much. And I would say ranges carved out of standing trees isn't very good either - for years in MN I had two places I shot long range and both were like this - not very good conditions to practice your wind calls.

I would also say practicing long range on a range that has wind flags might be better than nothing, but not much better.

All that said, it is important to practice other positions as well. Sitting with a sling at 300...standing at 100, sitting with a BogPod at 400, etc. I shoot more rounds at prairie dogs in the summer than anything else - nothing else beats crosshairs on game except competitive shooting.

I did have to laugh about the coyote misses - something about the way they come running in that frazzles you - I shot my last one about 50 yards away but missed one before that from about 70. Elk coming into a call - no problem. Coyotes? Different story.

Your first statement is what we call chasing the spotter.

The most enjoyable match I ever shot in was in Blair Atholl in Northern Scotland. That was in 1998. 3 on the firing point; one shooting, 2nd getting ready to shoot, 3rd scoring. Rotate responsibility. There were cadets pulling targets.

When target is put up, pit puller starts his timer, 45 seconds later target goes down. If shooter fails to fire, scorer gives him a miss.

Shooters can't pick their condition, can't wait, doesn't know how much wind the previous shooter had, so, suck it up, give it your best wind correction and break the shot in 45 seconds.

Match was from 300 to 1000 across 2 days.

BTW, the borrowed rifle, and borrowed ammo took the high score, and high V bull, their version of X ring.

Here is the picture of rifle/ammo confirmation I shot the day before the match. Just 200 yards. All matches there prone. The target stayed at their club house till about 8 years ago. The gentleman who provided the rifle/ammo sent it to me. He tried to have his club mates break the group size. It stood there since 98, no one did. The flyer was a jitter shot, 10th.