Floating bolt head on 700??

[JJMoody]

Been thinkin stuff up and wondering (dis)advantages??.. of building a replacement bolt (ptg style replacement) for a 700. Is this possible? My thoughts were to be kinda like savage for the diy-er. Would you Still need to blueprint the action, or would a floating bolt head help take care of that? Would this help to decrease cost/ lead times for putting together a semi-custom, or am I just barking up the dummy tree here? Seems like folks like the savage actions for this reason, and the things can flat out shoot, but they're so stinkin ugly... what say ye?

 

[shortgrass]

I don't think the "floating" bolt head is the only part that makes those Savages shoot. Seems to me, Big Horn actions use the "floating" bolt head. The 'heart' of a rifles accuracy is in the barrel.

 

[JJMoody]

I believe you're right, the Bighorns do use the floater. Barrels are for sure key, but then why blueprint? Is there an advantage to a floating bolt head?

 

[shortgrass]

When 'blue printing', there are other places machined upon, not just the bolt/bolt face. On a Savage, the barrel doesn't 'shoulder-up' like it does on a Winchester or Remington. I'd say the nut performs similarly, but not identically. And the locking abutments. Whether the bolt head 'floats' or not, preferably the bolt face should be at 90* to the center-line upon ignition with both lugs making full contact with their abutments. What if both lugs are not making contact? As the bolt head 'floats' , the lugs will both make contact, but the bolt face may not be 90* to the center-line anymore. You must have an old centerless grinder sitting idle and needing a job.

 

[JJMoody]

Ha!! No... nothing like that. I'm actually stitching leather belts and during the long straight stretches, there's a lot of time to think stuff up! There's a Bighorn in the classifieds, drove by a pawn shop that has a bunch of used savages and I said to myself, " Self, why don't no one make a replacement bolt for a 700 with a floating bolt head, use a barrel nut and do the DIY remage without blue printing??" The Savage is DIY friendly, it'll shoot bugholes, but they're just plain ugly!! And whilst I sat here watching a sewing machine work, I asked the question..

 

[JJMoody]

I actually wish the question was as informed as having a piece of equipment needing a job

 

[Danny1788]

The shilen actions made by "Stiller" are Rem 700 clones with a floating bolt head and savage Small shank threads/tenon. Pretty sure that's what your looking for right? makes barrel changes easy and use rem trigger, mag boxes, stocks etc....

 

[JJMoody]

Definitely something similar to that concept, only was just thinking if building the replacement bolt alone would accomplish anything? Remington bolts aren't typically great and many guys get one from PTG anyway, so would it make any sense to make one with a floating head? Would it enable a guy to spin off a factory barrel, replace the bolt and screw on a new barrel nut barrel to have a decent semi custom? I feel like I'm missing something, but maybe I'm on to something?

 

[martinakl]

"Discontinued" on midwayusa.com but PTG has made, or maybe still does make, what you're talking about. @ $480, they couldn't have sold very many.

https://www.midwayusa.com/product/1...t-head-308-winchester-bolt-face-spiral-fluted

 

[J E Custom]

Been thinkin stuff up and wondering (dis)advantages??.. of building a replacement bolt (ptg style replacement) for a 700. Is this possible? My thoughts were to be kinda like savage for the diy-er. Would you Still need to blueprint the action, or would a floating bolt head help take care of that? Would this help to decrease cost/ lead times for putting together a semi-custom, or am I just barking up the dummy tree here? Seems like folks like the savage actions for this reason, and the things can flat out shoot, but they're so stinkin ugly... what say ye?

As a gunsmith I prefer the one piece bolt for many reasons. A one piece bolt can be blue printed along with the receiver so that everything is in perfect alignment. The "floating" bolt head has many moving parts that can only compound the machining errors by introducing more possible alignment problems, And is designed for ease of assembly and case head changes (So one bolt can be used for many different cartridges by changing only the bolt head). And the fact that both the lugs come into contact with the receiver lugs is no guaranty
that it will remain perpendicular to the case head and the chamber reducing case life.

I have worked on many floating bolt head receivers and they are more trouble to square up. as shortgrass said there is more to there accuracy than the "Floating bolt head". A good barrel is the heart of an accurate
rifle, all other improvements only helps.

And to answer your question, NO I would leave the bolt alone and have everything trued (Blue printed)

Just my opinion

J E CUSTOM

 

[shortgrass]

My opinion of the "floating' bolt head..... It is designed for ease of manufacturing on Savages' part. All the bolt bodies are the same (per action length). Just the bolt head is different per cartridge the rifles barrel is chambered for. Less dedicated parts in inventory. And not nearly as complicated to manufacture than a bolt body with a non-removable bolt head. Does it contribute to accuracy? The only way I can think of to test it would be with a 'solid' bolt, and that doesn't exist for the Savage. No test that concludes the 'floating' bolt head is the 'key' to the accuracy? Then it's just speculation.

 

[Punisher]

I don't think the "floating" bolt head is the only part that makes those Savages shoot. Seems to me, Big Horn actions use the "floating" bolt head. The 'heart' of a rifles accuracy is in the barrel.

Bighorn has a 700 clone with footing bolt head.

 

[Punisher]

My opinion of the "floating' bolt head..... It is designed for ease of manufacturing on Savages' part. All the bolt bodies are the same (per action length). Just the bolt head is different per cartridge the rifles barrel is chambered for. Less dedicated parts in inventory. And not nearly as complicated to manufacture than a bolt body with a non-removable bolt head. Does it contribute to accuracy? The only way I can think of to test it would be with a 'solid' bolt, and that doesn't exist for the Savage. No test that concludes the 'floating' bolt head is the 'key' to the accuracy? Then it's just speculation.

This says to me that you and I need to sit down and make a one piece bolt for a Savage. We can test 5 guns and try both bolts with the same ammo.

Then we know for sure.

 

[shortgrass]

This says to me that you and I need to sit down and make a one piece bolt for a Savage. We can test 5 guns and try both bolts with the same ammo.

Then we know for sure.

You have not completely thought this through. Re-designing the bolt body would also require a re-design of the firing pin and probably every other part involved. I am not much of a Savage guy to begin with. And with the back-log I currently have, there is certainly no way I would spend my time making one piece bolts (actually 2 piece, as 1 piece would mean with the handle integral). Customs...... And Savages are far, far from custom. If guys want to mess with them, fine. "Kit guns", just like the 1911 pistols and AR series rifles. Easily assembled without many specialized tools, knowledge or higher end skills. I do not believe for one minute that the engineers at Savage designed these to be "kit guns", only for ease of manufacture,,,,,, to meet a price point. I have been involved with manufacturing for far, far too long to believe otherwise. Spend time and money trying to improve one? No me! Not by a long shot.