FL Sizing - Necessary??

[Bitis Arietans]

Good Day All...
Many have weighed in on my past issue and have helped...My issue was that after FL Sizing the 7MM RM cartridges would be very tight in my bolt action rifle.
The conclusion seem to be that I have a "tight" chamber.
Even with camming over, the rounds wouldn't chamber correctly.

Ultimately, I lapped (filed down) a shell holder and my problem went away!

My question is: Must I FL size the cases at all? The once fired brass chambers fine.

Thanks much!!

 

[Rich Coyle]

When I ran a 2,000 test on a Savage .223 I discovered every seven times it was necessary to full length size. The rest of the time I necked sized. One of the tests was full length compared to neck sized. Neck sized were more accurate in that rifle.

 

[Dosh]

You can get by with neck sizing only, but in a tight chamber perhaps not very many. Would help to anneal after the third firing and full length size/trim at the same time. Check your neck sized brass in the chamber before you load them each reloading. My grandson's 25-06 chamber is tight and this process seems to be the best for him. His lands are closer to the chamber than normal also. The 115 Berger would not allow the bolt to closed at Berger manual seating spec. This rifle is going to be an AI soon.

 

[bigedp51]

 

[Bitis Arietans]

I guess the only way to neck size is with a neck die??

I actually used to neck size, and when the rounds wouldn't chamber in my falling block I sold them.
A new neck die is only about $25 so I'll try that if you really think it'll improve accuracy.

Thanks much as always, for your expertise.!

 

[Bitis Arietans]

Big E...I'm sorry I missed your post...and thanks for your reply.

I guess my initial question is: If the once fired brass chambers, Do I need to size at ALL??

 

[Buckskinner]

I have seen that Lapua thread reposted so many times I have it almost to memory. Few key points in there to pull out. One - that he's never neck sized so really is just stating his bias and that of his predecessor. Two - that he needed the bullets to be shot out of several different guns, obviously not going to neck size then. Three - that he was working with very accurate guns and if they did not shoot 1/2" moa they didn't try to load to it they just got a different barrel put on it.

Most of use change methodologies, components, volumes and measurements first before scrapping the barrel...

I'm thinking rat turd in a violin case is a bit extreme, but you should bump the shoulders from time to time...

 

[bigedp51]

Big E...I'm sorry I missed your post...and thanks for your reply.

I guess my initial question is: If the once fired brass chambers, Do I need to size at ALL??

If it chambers without resizing the only real question is will the case extract without binding.

A full length resized case is always the same diameter and headspace length. Meaning it will chamber and extract because the cases are always uniform.

I prefer full length resizing but sometimes your forced to neck size like I do with all my Enfield rifles in .303 British.

 

[Rich Coyle]

A starting note: These were fired before I discovered and started correcting seated bullet run out.

The objective of these groups is to compare full length resized .223 Remington cases to cases which were neck sized only. On the full length resizes cases, I pushed the shoulders back about .001" so they would fit the chamber with absolutely no bolt closing resistance. A Stoney Point over all length gauge help with this task. I sized the necks in a Hornady .224 neck sizing die about .100"; which was plenty to hold a 52 grain JLK bullet since it was seated in only .080". All full length cases were resized utilizing the Hornady New Dimension Custom Grade dies. The barrel cooled quickly between groups because the temperature was 30 degrees when I started shooting and edged up to 35 degrees by the conclusion.

This is an out of the box Savage rifle, the best four shots out of five are also included. The rifle was cleaned and three fowlers fired prior to the testing.


H 322 charged full length resized cases produced a velocity of 3,548 fps. The group measured .579" with 4 @ .415". The neck sized cases generated 3,586 fps and a group of .844" with 4 @ .486".

H 335 powered full length cases produced 3,558 fps and a flyer group of .784" with 4 @ .379". The neck sized speed was 3,607 fps and the group was .527" with 4 @ .473".

AA 2230 loaded full length cases pushed the 52s to 3,531 fps, and the group was .604" with 4 @ .337". The neck sized cases did 3,580 fps and made a group of .445" with 4 @ .250".

BL-C(2) full lengthers flew down range at 3,532 fps and made a group of .671" with 4 @ .406". The necked sized load dashed away at 3,574 fps making a group of .491" with 4 @ .394". The average for the full length groups is .6595". On the other hand the groups for neck sized averaged .5767" for a difference of .0828".

 

[Buckskinner]

Interesting that the velocity was +40 to 50 ft/sec faster in the neck sized!

 

[Rich Coyle]

Don't want to go off topic, but I did the same thing with random cases and weigh sorted cases. Also I did the same thing with about half dozen primers being the only change. I just remember another test. I ran a test with 1.68" high rings and 2.2" high rings. That took a few hours to complete. I posted the results on a web sight and lots of folks didn't like the results. In fact, they were angry!

 

[eklarsen]

Did you measure and trim your brass to the proper spec?
When you FL resize your brass, that working of the metal will lengthen the case as the brass has to go somewhere and it is 100% in length. Check that first.

 

[rcoody]

Different strokes for different folks. Only thing that matters is what works for you. I have tried it all.

I prefer full length resizing.

I see no real benefits from neck sizing and a host of problems. You are going to get only so many firings neck sizing before you have to full length resize anyway.

There are some great full length dies out there that are stock dies that approach custom dies.

Check out the Harrell dies.

You can have a forster honed to your preferred neck tension

Whidden has a new kit with a range of expander balls to adjust neck tension

Expander Ball Kits – Whidden Gunworks

 

[Buckskinner]

Don't want to go off topic, but I did the same thing with random cases and weigh sorted cases. Also I did the same thing with about half dozen primers being the only change. I just remember another test. I ran a test with 1.68" high rings and 2.2" high rings. That took a few hours to complete. I posted the results on a web sight and lots of folks didn't like the results. In fact, they were angry!

Why angry? I'd like to see those results!