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Do you prefer a hunting rifle with a detachable mag?
- Thread starter Len Backus
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So you reckon if a bear sneaks up on ya you will be able to change magazines quick enough to get it before it gets you?
Why not just load for the heaviest game in the area you hunt and use it for everything. At least you will get more than one shot off cause you are already loaded.
Why not just load for the heaviest game in the area you hunt and use it for everything. At least you will get more than one shot off cause you are already loaded.
Big jedd, multiple magazines for different bullet options depending on game and distance...just my preference. As far as bear... changing the magazine was not the point...but, having a mag feed with whatever bullet was in there...thus multiple shots was the 2nd point. Single feed actions similar to what alot of BR folks use just wouldn't be my choice in that situation.
Just curious though what caliber and bullet selection do you use on elk at 1000 yards and also on small deer at 100 yards or yotes at 200 yards?
Just curious though what caliber and bullet selection do you use on elk at 1000 yards and also on small deer at 100 yards or yotes at 200 yards?
Chas! sorry I misunderstood what you were getting at with the magazine ,however I do prefer a fixed magazine for all hunting, benchresting is a different story altogether.
Chas at my age eye sight is not as good as it was but to me it is unethical to shoot game at 1000yds if you miss judge and only wound the animal its 1000yds to walk before you can start to track it out and they will go a long way in that time. Because I dont snipe at 1000yds but prefer to hunt as close as possible to the game, I use an appropriate calibre for the range I am hunting over most times under 200yds.
I own rifles in 270wsm using 140gr accubond , 300wsm using 165grwoodleigh, 338RCM using 225gr woodleigh ,and 375Ruger using 260gr accubond or 270gr SSt's. Most of these set ups are designed to do a particular job and I use one bullet to do it all in that rifle.
I have yet to find a rifle that will consistantly place different weight bullets on the same point of aim , so I get to know one bullet weight and never need to adjust the scope. I just take what rifle I am gunna use for the hunt and know I am pretty much covered for what might come along. In most cases the trajectory is fairly close for each of these rifles so I can consentrate on hunting closer instead of fiddling around with trajectories.
Its not everyones ideal setup but it has served me well for the past 20 years although not always with the same rifles. for a while I used a 30/06 with 180gr projectiles and a 25/06 with 100 or 120gr projectiles.
Chas at my age eye sight is not as good as it was but to me it is unethical to shoot game at 1000yds if you miss judge and only wound the animal its 1000yds to walk before you can start to track it out and they will go a long way in that time. Because I dont snipe at 1000yds but prefer to hunt as close as possible to the game, I use an appropriate calibre for the range I am hunting over most times under 200yds.
I own rifles in 270wsm using 140gr accubond , 300wsm using 165grwoodleigh, 338RCM using 225gr woodleigh ,and 375Ruger using 260gr accubond or 270gr SSt's. Most of these set ups are designed to do a particular job and I use one bullet to do it all in that rifle.
I have yet to find a rifle that will consistantly place different weight bullets on the same point of aim , so I get to know one bullet weight and never need to adjust the scope. I just take what rifle I am gunna use for the hunt and know I am pretty much covered for what might come along. In most cases the trajectory is fairly close for each of these rifles so I can consentrate on hunting closer instead of fiddling around with trajectories.
Its not everyones ideal setup but it has served me well for the past 20 years although not always with the same rifles. for a while I used a 30/06 with 180gr projectiles and a 25/06 with 100 or 120gr projectiles.
Goofycat
Well-Known Member
Which leads to another question in my mind: Is there any difference in loss of stock rigidity when a detachable box is used vs. the hinged floorplate? I am used to using only single-shot rifles (mostly) and have never owned one with a DBM. I plan to buy a Savage Predator Hunter next year, and it may be offered (I don't know yet) with a DBM in .243 (for coyotes only).
I know that some people like the hinge format, while others like the DBM. Frankly, from my limited knowledge about the DBM, it seems like it would be more user friendly for those who hunt with others and are constantly in and out of the hunting vehicle. I was always taught to travel with an empty rifle, and after hunting boars with my hinge-type .270, I found that having to empty the rifle when getting into the vehicle, then refill it again when changing hunting stands got to get old very quickly. It always seemed to me that having a DBM would always be preferable to having to mess around with a hinge-type cartridge holder.
Barry
I know that some people like the hinge format, while others like the DBM. Frankly, from my limited knowledge about the DBM, it seems like it would be more user friendly for those who hunt with others and are constantly in and out of the hunting vehicle. I was always taught to travel with an empty rifle, and after hunting boars with my hinge-type .270, I found that having to empty the rifle when getting into the vehicle, then refill it again when changing hunting stands got to get old very quickly. It always seemed to me that having a DBM would always be preferable to having to mess around with a hinge-type cartridge holder.
Barry
Goofycat, I would imagine that loading and unloading a hinged floorplate, you could accidently mess up the tip of certain bullet and it's to me a little more of a juggling act too. As far as stock stiffness goes I can't speak to synthetics but on wood stocks with heavy recoiling magnums you have to make sure you have enough meat(wood) on each side of the action/mag area or you'll get flexing and eventually a cracked stock. Whereas with a single shot you don't need as thick a stock.
Goofycat
Well-Known Member
Thanks, Chas. What you say makes sense. I never really was concerned before with stock rigidity since my single shot rifles were made for stiffness (with the exception of the .270 and its hinged floor-plate.
I think most rifles made today are designed around a calibre/ cartridge combination and the problem with cracked stocks etc isnt as bad as it was when people modified existing rifles to do an upgrade to larger calibres etc. Of course there is exceptions to the rule when manufacturers try for false economical reasons to push there stocks to do heavier jobs than originally designed but as a rule there not too bad.
The single shot certainly would be stiffer and give a stronger action not by the fact of the wood being one piece but because the action dosen't have a cut out for a magazine which has to make the action stiffer.
With a single shot being used for hunting you lose the advantage of a quick followup shot unless you are able to carry the ammo some way that allows you to access it quickly. Most sytems that allow that to happen would leave the ammo just as vulnerable to point damage as it would loading and unloading a hinged floorplate magazine. This damage could just as easily happen to ammo stored in a detachable magazine whilst moving around from stand to stand or driving over rough roads to a different hunting location.
I believe the whole issue of bullet deformation is overated and realisticly the damage to the point in a hunting rifle isnt going to effect the accuracy on a hunting rifle as much as the inability to hold a rifle steady enough in hunting situations.
With the detachable magazine I have seen many times where hunters have jump out of a vehicle in anticipation of getting on to a fleeing animal and left the magazine on the seat or dash have also seen a hunter run down a gully for 100yds only to find he had left his bolt behind. Shoot!! I even saw one bloke so excited he forgot to take his rifle. There has been some rifles that have had problems with the detachable magazines falling out unknown to the hunter . One model I have seen this happen with is the tikka and I once saw it happen with a remington fitted with a detachable magazine.
With the hinged floorplate it dosent take all that much time to drop the ammo out and most times you can push the ammo in the magazine while walking to where you need to be to get a shot of. When moving between stands etc it meens bugger all as once you get to the stand you still need to set up and what are we talking about maybe 30 to 50 seconds at tops to reload.
The single shot certainly would be stiffer and give a stronger action not by the fact of the wood being one piece but because the action dosen't have a cut out for a magazine which has to make the action stiffer.
With a single shot being used for hunting you lose the advantage of a quick followup shot unless you are able to carry the ammo some way that allows you to access it quickly. Most sytems that allow that to happen would leave the ammo just as vulnerable to point damage as it would loading and unloading a hinged floorplate magazine. This damage could just as easily happen to ammo stored in a detachable magazine whilst moving around from stand to stand or driving over rough roads to a different hunting location.
I believe the whole issue of bullet deformation is overated and realisticly the damage to the point in a hunting rifle isnt going to effect the accuracy on a hunting rifle as much as the inability to hold a rifle steady enough in hunting situations.
With the detachable magazine I have seen many times where hunters have jump out of a vehicle in anticipation of getting on to a fleeing animal and left the magazine on the seat or dash have also seen a hunter run down a gully for 100yds only to find he had left his bolt behind. Shoot!! I even saw one bloke so excited he forgot to take his rifle. There has been some rifles that have had problems with the detachable magazines falling out unknown to the hunter . One model I have seen this happen with is the tikka and I once saw it happen with a remington fitted with a detachable magazine.
With the hinged floorplate it dosent take all that much time to drop the ammo out and most times you can push the ammo in the magazine while walking to where you need to be to get a shot of. When moving between stands etc it meens bugger all as once you get to the stand you still need to set up and what are we talking about maybe 30 to 50 seconds at tops to reload.
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There's alot of BAT HPRIC and Borden Timberline Magnum actions to mention a few with DBM shooting way far out there many times 1000+ yards with exceptional accuracy but put these actions in a wood stock without enough wood on both sides of the action will result in flexing and cracked stocks and degrading accuracy...I wasn't and am not talking about the average commercial stock like remys etc. I'm not disagreeing with Bigjedd's point about a single shot being stiffer and stronger action but if the action selected is on the big side let's say a BAT model M and your having a wood stock custom made and don't want stock too wide then the wood not taken out for a magazine will allow for a thinner stock. Type of stocks and their stiffness are discussed here all the time. It is a factor.
Goofycat
Well-Known Member
Which leads to what I think about lead points: I am not happy with them. I have screwed up more cartridges with lead-pointed bullets than I would care to think about. After I started reloading with the Nosler and Hornady plastic points, the problem was resolved. I know that not all bullets have Spitzer-type tips, but such companies as Sierra still continue to manufacture them---at least in many of the smaller calibers. That being the case, I would probably tend to use a DBM, since I would imagine that there would be less of a chance of banging up the bullet tips as might be the case when inserting and removing the cartridges from a hinged floor-plate type setup.
I realize that single shot rifles present a challenge when hunting coyotes. I would ideally like an AR in .243, but California has made it impossible to own one. So...next choice is a bolt action, although the Ruger Ranch Rifle in .223 is another choice. My experience is that once the animal is spooked by a missed shot, a second shot (even if from a semi-automatic rifle) is mostly worthless anyway, so I usually pick my shots carefully with the .22-250. trigger. The rifle was put together by Darrell Holland in 1996; uses a McMillan synthetic stock, blueprinted 40X receiver and Hart barrel. I had been using Nosler Ballistic Tips in 55 grain, but I don't think they penetrate enough to give me immediate kills. Probably due to poor shot placement; that's my fault.
I am experimenting with the newer Nosler Accubonds, but I haven't read much about this bullet, other than it appears to be kind of a hybrid between a Nosler Partition and a Ballistic Tip.
I realize that single shot rifles present a challenge when hunting coyotes. I would ideally like an AR in .243, but California has made it impossible to own one. So...next choice is a bolt action, although the Ruger Ranch Rifle in .223 is another choice. My experience is that once the animal is spooked by a missed shot, a second shot (even if from a semi-automatic rifle) is mostly worthless anyway, so I usually pick my shots carefully with the .22-250. trigger. The rifle was put together by Darrell Holland in 1996; uses a McMillan synthetic stock, blueprinted 40X receiver and Hart barrel. I had been using Nosler Ballistic Tips in 55 grain, but I don't think they penetrate enough to give me immediate kills. Probably due to poor shot placement; that's my fault.
I am experimenting with the newer Nosler Accubonds, but I haven't read much about this bullet, other than it appears to be kind of a hybrid between a Nosler Partition and a Ballistic Tip.
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