California varmint/lead free design - 20/5.7x28FN - discussion

[Deleted member 46119]

I don't think that swaging is needed for plinking. 24 gauge solid wire is just 0.003 inch under the .204 caliber spec. That is soft and could be cut with nail clippers or wire cutters.

A person could easily cut 1,000 of them from $10 of wire, and sort by weight while watching Netflix.

I understand the desire for avoiding a new, custom made action to run a low cost, .22LR replacement. I can buy a lot of .270 win hand loads before getting payback vs. buying any small caliber and doing an ROI calculation.

That is one reason I try to only buy guns that are "substantially" different, that and budget challenges of course.

You got me going on the 24 gauge wire. It wouldn't take much to make up the swagging system on a progressive press. Well, I don't think so......

Biggest thing is that with such a small bullet, not much force is needed.

Just one pull to swag and one push to eject. The lower "die" portion would ride in the shell plate so that when the die is over the primer installer the push will eject the bullet.

Brain fodder for making things.

 

[HarryN]

There is a fairly serious error in my last post. 24 gauge wire is 0.02x diameter, not 0.2x diameter like you need. That will require closer to 4 gauge wire.

Sorry for that.

I did see 5mm solid brass rod on McMaster for $12/meter, but it is 3% Pb vs official rule of 1%.

I also saw that at least for hunting, the requirement calls for "certified projectiles". There is a form and it looks like a low hurdle.

 

[Deleted member 46119]

There is a fairly serious error in my last post. 24 gauge wire is 0.02x diameter, not 0.2x diameter like you need. That will require closer to 4 gauge wire.

Sorry for that.

I did see 5mm solid brass rod on McMaster for $12/meter, but it is 3% Pb vs official rule of 1%.

I also saw that at least for hunting, the requirement calls for "certified projectiles". There is a form and it looks like a low hurdle.

I saw that. No biggie. I still think cutting plugs and a quick swag will work. It's an in expensive source. I have to see if it can be done for a non-burdened cost less than buying VGs

 

[HarryN]

I wonder if it would make any sense to buy pre-made copper bullet jackets in the desired caliber, pour in something to add mass (example waste tire rubber powder) and load them tail forward?

They would be kind of blunt on both ends, but possibly very consistent.

 

[Gerard Schultz]

HarryN,

Do not worry too much about the weight difference with and without drive bands. The way the GSC drive bands are done, a 200gr bullet will go to about 208gr, a 160gr bullet will go to 167gr and so on. The engraving pressure of a conventional bullet is about 3500psi while the engraving pressure of a GSC drive band bullet is less than 1000psi and I will take the lack of gas blow by in the leade and the low engraving pressure, over the small difference in weight any day.

 

[HarryN]

Hi Gerard, thank you for you advice. I have learned a great deal just from studying the information on the GSC web site.

The bullets produced by GSC and other premium grade manufacturers are first class, and reasonably priced, considering the effort, testing, and quality control involved.

At the same time, many people in states like CA are in a bind when it comes to lead free, teach your kids the basics, 50 meter plinking ammo.

For example, monolithic makes a perfect .270 win round for when I shoot, but at $3/round, I doubt that I could just let my son have fun goofing around gaining comfortable use without going batty.

 

[HarryN]

We are just exploring ways to make really low cost, old fashioned, .22LR type options.

One idea is to just use an empty copper jacket from J4, or fill it with something relatively inert. A very low cost, 25-50 meter children's training bullet. No idea if that is viable or not.

 

[HarryN]

I did some more reading about the FN 5.7x28. Early bullets appear to have been little more than copper jackets and a polymer filling, just 25 grains or so.

Copper jackets are pretty cheap.

 

[HarryN]

I put a WTB adv in the classifieds section for a small quantity of .270 and .223 copper jackets in case anyone is able to sell a few for my testing. Thanks