Bullets for Long Range Dogs

[Catawampus]

I am going to SD on first dog hunt in July. I have 223 and 22-250 for short range and am planning on using 308, 6BR and 300RUM for long range. I only have 175SMK for 308 and 105 Berger Match VLD for the BR. Nothing worked out for the RUM yet.

What bullets should I use that will be ok in the wind and efficient killers at long range? Are these match bullets a bad idea at longer ranges?

I really appreciate any feedback.

 

[Armed in Utah]

Quite frankly...the 308 & RUM would be two of my last p/dog rifle choices..especially if they are run of the mill field weight rifles..a 9# RUM sending a 175 gr SMK is gonna be no fun for the shooter...or his buddies next to him....the other factor would be the richochet of these heavy non expanding target bullets....heat would be another issue....85* air temp in July...barrel heat from the RUM.....leave it home...stick with the 223..22-250 & 6BR....load them up with good varmint bullets...IE...Hornady V max...Nosler BTs...or Sierra BK's...the Berger VLD 6mm will work OK...but they will punch a hole in & out....expect crawl offs...the above mentioned varmint bullets will provide more arials & red mist...my favorite 223 AI bullet is the 53 gr V max...high BC.. .291 I believe..my 12 twist 6BR favors 75 V max....70 NBT....all the bullet you need...my dog guns are table guns....running 17-18#....I let the bullet do the walking for me...what you should consider...20 caliber is where its at for p/doggin'.........4000 fps 40 gr V max............

 

[Catawampus]

Thanks, the 223 is a heavy AR and the 22-250 is a HV Hall match rifle. These will be doing the bulk of the shooting at sub 500 yards.

The RUM is a 700 Sendero donor rifle for a 338 Edge project I am starting so if the barrel does not survive the trip that is fine. I was planning on bringing 50-75 rounds for this one. I was leaning toward 200 grain bullets or the highest BC that will kill efficiently at 1000+.

The 308 is a heavy varmint Krieger that I was hoping could fill the gap to 1000 yards. The 6mm is another HV that is easy to shoot. Your comment on crawlers with the Berger Match and SMKs is one of my concerns.

From what I am seeing in external ballistic apps is that beyond 500 yards high BC is the best choice but do not see any frangible bullets in the over .500 class. The other obvious challenge is component availability. It is difficult to find any 6mm bullets right now. 30 cals are easier to find but no one really makes a "varmint" bullet in this BC class.

Are the guys that are hitting beyond 1000 yards accepting the chance of crawlers and using match bullets anyway? Does the extra weight of the high BC bullets make up for the lack of frangibility?

 

[Browninglover1]

You won't get many crawlers with a 30 caliber bullet. I've shot them with the 185 grain Berger from a 300 WSM and they didn't crawl off; they also didn't pop quite like a varmint bullet but I wasn't interested in that effect when I shot the 300.

I would get some 210, 215, or 230 Bergers and have a blast throwing some lead at sod poodles near the 1k mark.

 

[Gale Johnson]

I shoot p dogs quite frequently and would have to agree that the 53 gr Vmax is a super fine bullet, splat factor can't be beat, lots of launching and parts flying. I shot one today with a 32 gr calhoon Saber Tip in 19-223, lots of terminal performance, saw parts going in several directions in the scope. Best thing was it was a "gopher" load, 13.5 gr Blue Dot. My point is more isn't always better, take what you got and have fun, but the use enough gun theory doesn't apply to pasture poodles.

 

[Catawampus]

You won't get many crawlers with a 30 caliber bullet. I've shot them with the 185 grain Berger from a 300 WSM and they didn't crawl off; they also didn't pop quite like a varmint bullet but I wasn't interested in that effect when I shot the 300.

I would get some 210, 215, or 230 Bergers and have a blast throwing some lead at sod poodles near the 1k mark.

Thanks Brownignlover1. That is the feedback I was looking for. Now to find and test some bullets.

 

[Catawampus]

I shoot p dogs quite frequently and would have to agree that the 53 gr Vmax is a super fine bullet, splat factor can't be beat, lots of launching and parts flying. I shot one today with a 32 gr calhoon Saber Tip in 19-223, lots of terminal performance, saw parts going in several directions in the scope. Best thing was it was a "gopher" load, 13.5 gr Blue Dot. My point is more isn't always better, take what you got and have fun, but the use enough gun theory doesn't apply to pasture poodles.

Gale,
What is a long shot for the 19cal? What BC is that 32gr bullet?

 

[Gale Johnson]

I don't know the BC of the Calhoon made bullets. The Blue Dot load is limited to about 200 yards, i shot a few at about 400 with a full power(about 4000 fps) load but that is a very long shot for me with a little Cooper 21 Classic sporter over the hood of a pickup. I think the 19-223 Calhoon is similar to a 204 Ruger for max range. My friend left me his TAC 20 in a Cooper mtv to work up some loads, It should be a bit better long ranger. I personally just like shooting them and not trying to break any distance records and don't ever take a bench to shoot from, just more of a drive by prarie dog hunt. I was recently in the Bend OR area on a Sage Rat hunt and one guy was shooting them with a full on 6BR, what ever trips your trigger. We shot a couple thousand rounds of mostly 17 hmr in 2 days and had a blast. Sorry to bring your thread off topic, just relaying my findings. I have a 25-06 and 220 Swift but find myself reaching for the smaller guns time after time when going to kill a pdog.

Have a good trip and report back, i think there are a few more dogs in the west this year and i just saw my first batch of Pups on Friday.

 

[Catawampus]

I don't know the BC of the Calhoon made bullets. The Blue Dot load is limited to about 200 yards, i shot a few at about 400 with a full power(about 4000 fps) load but that is a very long shot for me with a little Cooper 21 Classic sporter over the hood of a pickup. I think the 19-223 Calhoon is similar to a 204 Ruger for max range. My friend left me his TAC 20 in a Cooper mtv to work up some loads, It should be a bit better long ranger. I personally just like shooting them and not trying to break any distance records and don't ever take a bench to shoot from, just more of a drive by prarie dog hunt. I was recently in the Bend OR area on a Sage Rat hunt and one guy was shooting them with a full on 6BR, what ever trips your trigger. We shot a couple thousand rounds of mostly 17 hmr in 2 days and had a blast. Sorry to bring your thread off topic, just relaying my findings. I have a 25-06 and 220 Swift but find myself reaching for the smaller guns time after time when going to kill a pdog.

Have a good trip and report back, i think there are a few more dogs in the west this year and i just saw my first batch of Pups on Friday.

Gale,
It is great to hear from the other end of the scale. The Sage Rats sound like a whole lotta fun. Not something we have an opportunity for on the East Coast. I find myself collecting more 22rf rifles. I just got a LH CZ and a custom Sako P94 but with this trip coming I have had little time to play with them.

Thanks for the good report on the pdogs. Really looking forward to our trip.

Paul

 

[Gale Johnson]

I will be heading up to Pierre, SD in the next few weeks to go fishing, i will see how many pdogs are out and about and ask some of the shooters at the hotel how they did.

The Sage Rats are a absolute blast, i had a lot of fun shooting them with the HMR, perfect rat gun. Now i just need to get a nicer 17 with better optics, I took a Marlin with a Simmons scope and wasn't planning on using it but it was too much fun to quit once i tried it out. My friend that went shot over 20 boxes of HMR. He had a nicer gun, a Ruger HMR Bolt Gun that had some work done, it will shoot .25 groups, the Ruger Rotary Clip loads faster also.

 

[MachV]

I've been fortunate enough to shoot dogs in about every state that has them with everything from the 17HMR to the 50BMG.
If you get lucky and find a lot of dogs that aint been shot a lot the 223 and an accurate 22lr will be your friend=good luck with that one these days! The 22-250 will make some memorable shoots too but it heats up fast.
If however you run into spookie dogs the 223 will be reaching hard and the 22lr worthless. The 22-250 with 53Vnaxes will reach out to 500 with effective results but the wind and mirage are going to be key players.
The 6br with 87 grain Vmax makes a great long range round but good luck finding any. The 100+ grainers work alright too but it takes a lot of elevation in the scope to get there, so will the 308 for that matter. Getting an exact range and a good spotter are going to be key elements of success.
If the 300 is going to be a 338 then why shoot the barrel out with spendy supplies?
We where out on Saturday with the 223s, a 300blackout, 308 and the 338 Edge.......long story short the 223s both got dogs farther than the bigger rounds=550 and 625 yards.
Good luck with your dogggin.

 

[1kstr]

A lot of pdogs have succumb to the 6mm Hornady 105 Amax. Just a pleasure to shoot out of a BR. Accurate, low cost and hangs in there for a long ways. Good luck.

1kstr