bertram vs adg. again.

[Nhyrum]

so, ive done a little digging, and have found the consensus is that adg is "better made" for lack of a better word, but pressures out sooner(stiff bolt lift, extractor marks, etc,) than bertram, and bertrams primer pockets hold up more. I heard this was a early run issue with ADG. the posts ive seen here have been regarding 6.5 prc and 338 edge. the 338 edge is my end goal, shooting a 300 rum right now. price between the two makers is about the same, give or take 10-20 cents a piece. Having found these posts, i wasnt sure if reviving a dead thread and hijacking it was necessary.

so, my question. Is that a "hard and fast rule" that ADG is more consistent, but bertram will hold up to hotter loads, longer? If i were to buy 200 of either, would it be feasible that the bertram i could use when i shoot out the rum barrel and spin on a edge barrel(after about 1k down the tube), necking it up? and being able to then develop a load with the necked up rum brass, buy NEW edge brass and expect to keep the load(im not WANTING to, just asking if basically the bass internal dimensions would be the same, necked up 300 rum vs 338 edge) could i expect either to last 5 firings?

does any of this make sense?

 

[lancetkenyon]

I had a batch of Bertram .338 Edge brass that was terrible with weight consistency. Across 100 pieces, there was an 11 grain weight variation.
All ADG brass batches I have gotten in various cartridges have been within 1.2gr across 100 pieces. I just ordered 500 pieces of ADG 28 Nosler brass, so I hope it is fairly close.

 

[Nhyrum]

thats what im seeing. bertram is terrible in terms of weight consistency and neck thickness, and rim thickness. im curious what your SD was for weights. while yes, you want the deviation as close to 0 as possible, percentage wise 11 grains has the potential to be a very small percentage. but with 1.2 grains availale, that seems to be hornady vs lapua consistency. how was brass life between the two?

 

[lancetkenyon]

The Bertram only has 2-3 firings on it. Still fine.

I have some ADG brass in various cartridges that have a lot of hot loads under their belts and still going strong.
6.5SS with up to 8 hot loads
28 Nosler with 5 hot loads
.300RUM with 4 max loads
6.5CM with 8 hot loads

 

[Wachsmann]

If you not at max pressure you should be able to get 5 to 6 loads out of your 300 RUM. Less pressure more reloads less stretch to everything. I also shoot the 300 and at max pressure I had a case issue at the 7th firing. So I through them away after 5 reloads. I also seen an issue at the 6th reload that made me stop at 5 now.

 

[Wedgy]

I had some of the 1st run Bertram Edge brass from DE and it was, still is, fantastic as far as consistency and toughness. I have a later box that didn't have the annealing on it like the 1st batch but I haven't had to use it yet. From the postings it seems Bertram is hit or miss these days and DE now uses and sells ADG instead of Bertram I would be inclined to go with ADG. Actually I wouldn't even consider Bertram anymore given the great reviews ADG has had and the hot or cold reviews on Bertram. The guy who invented the Edge switched to ADG.....that should say something.

Side note; what method of annealing do Lapua, ADG, etc. use ? induction, flame, bath ?
Picture is from DE's website

 

[laker]

I've had both Bertram and adg and I'd take the adg all day long. The quality to me is way better

 

[Wedgy]

brass, buy NEW edge brass and expect to keep the load(im not WANTING to, just asking if basically the bass internal dimensions would be the same, necked up 300 rum vs 338 edge)

Yes, the Edge is a necked up 300 RUM, I made Edge brass from 300 RUM. Some dies are labelled 338-300 Remington Ultra.
Number of firings depends on how hot you load them, and the brass. If you are going to run hot read this thread;
https://www.longrangehunting.com/threads/tighten-primer-pockets-heres-how.152361/

 

[Nhyrum]

Yes, the Edge is a necked up 300 RUM, I made Edge brass from 330 RUM.

I know that its a necked up 300 rum. what im wondering is if the case capacity of a factory 338 edge and a necked up 300 will be the same.

looks like ill probably buy ADG

 

[Wedgy]

I know that its a necked up 300 rum. what im wondering is if the case capacity of a factory 338 edge and a necked up 300 will be the same.

Looks like ill probably buy ADG

depends on the manufacturer, AKA the brass you started with....
Look...if you take short cuts .... you may suffer the consequences.
One thing at a time

 

[Nhyrum]

depends on the manufacturer, AKA the brass you started with....
Look...if you take short cuts .... you may suffer the consequences.
One thing at a time

I get that, im not looking for shortcuts. Just a curiousity that popped into my head, if formed edge brass would have the same capacity of factory edge brass. id be starting with ADG most likely and comparing it with ADG factory

 

[Doublezranch]

I bought 200 Bertram 340 Weatherby to fireform into a wildcat. The first 2 cracked the necks. I annealed the brass and tried again. Same results. So I sold it and bought Norma. Bertram brass seems thicker rendering in stronger. However making it stronger also can make the weight inconsistent. This was my first try with Bertram. I think it's good brass as long as your not trying to wildcat it.

 

[L.Sherm]

I saw the same thing as Lance did with 28 Nosler Bertram brass terrible weight difference and neck thickness.
The 28 ADG is awesome consistent 1.2 over 100 cases

 

[BrentM]

I have the gunwerks brass which is supposed to be adg. It was very good and consistent. I also have Peterson which has turned excellent too.