Target/ELR 375 HE..

[hubel458]

We are doing a 375 HE which will have slightly different specs for case and reamer

than the other 2 375s, Others didn't have time to make huge numbers of cases

needed and wanted theirs proprietary. 375HE is public domain. Reamer info which will

be at makers this week and published on 100 forums, on FB , are all public domain....

Case shallower 30 deg shoulder, little bigger shoulder, different body

section length measurements.

We will be making cases in large numbers, got orders for big numbers from

guys building mainly ELR guns. Got a few cases done for testing already.

Test gun ready so we can find best powder, highest speed next few weeks.

Some pictures be on here soon Ed

 

[hubel458]

pic

 

[trueblue]

Ed,
I don't see a pic

 

[hubel458]

Well I got it as a link, don't know how to get it

on the page . without the red tape, If you can do it,

p;ease do it.

jfseaman made print, I finally I got it from his email to my puter

and from puter this far as a link to attachment.. Ed.

 

[LC1]

Hopefully this image post.

Thanks

 

[Swamplord]

Let this be a lesson to all wildcatters out there who care about their cartridge designs and want to protect them ......

NEVER EVER post your cartridge dimensions/reamer prints on public forums as I just did recently, once you do, it is simple for another unscrupulous party to tweak a few numbers rename it and steal your design and boast about it as it's their own remarkable innovation and achievement, when it is nothing more than theft of intellectual property, when stuff like this happens in the corporate domain, huge lawsuits follow and drag on for years

 

[hubel458]

Hmm

we thought improving a case design was called wildcatting..

and mine may be worse than yours, he is making his Warlord

beltless, using beltless cases so those wanting beltless get with him, no reason to fight,

just get gund built so that there is 4 times as many at 2 mile next year.....Ed

 

[snox801]

I have tried agree with ed. How many different cheytac bases do we have. I do agree to never place yours online or yes they will take it. But I know of several others with only slightly different specs being laid out now.
Key is to have the best and fastest one and don't let that secret out of you are trying to make money off it.
I've never been in business in this realm so I don't know how much can be made with a design like this. I am also bias as I love seeing these monsters built.

 

[fmajor]

The matter, to me, seems all fine - so long as no additional revenue is being generated by someone other than Swamp (aside from an increase in brass hull sales).

It becomes poisoned fruit when someone takes the efforts of another (which was offered free of charge as a measure of goodwill) with the intent to cash in on those efforts. That just sucks in every way.

In the CheyTac example above whereby multiple CheyTac variants have been made, i don't see too much a problem as CheyTac is a for-profit enterprise and they have capitalized their costs.

However, i find it repugnant when one party capitalizes on another's efforts without even a consideration being offered.

A similar schite-storm occurred with the development of the 338 Lapua. So many hands were involved, yet proper identification/credit/consideration just didn't happen as well as it could have.

 

[snox801]

I get that. If you straight steal a design and start selling it at your own for profit you are a thief. But I see a case like this different. A wildcat was made off a produced piece of brass. Mainly necked down and shoulder angles. Then another had the same idea but thinks they can do it better with small changes. That's what drives progress. Imagine if this was the case with automobiles. We would still be rolling on steal wheels. The concept is already here and now it's just small changes hoping to improve. Now when one finds the right combo then I say keep it on lock down if you plan to profit much like Kirby does. I have no issues with this as he seems to have a great combo and wants to make money off it. It's up to the consumer to decide if it's worth the premium.

 

[hubel458]

And I don't make no profit, and neither do others unless as follows...

If we are not good smiths making labor and parts markup, no profit.

What comes in just pays for next batch to come in, like a group

buy with our cartridge name on it. Just pass it on at costs.Ed

 

[Deleted member 46119]

I wrote a really long post about why Swamplord and Hubel458 should not be arguing in public like this.

I cut it and saved it to a notepad.

I have something different to say.

Please Swamplord and Hubel458, stop bickering. No one is gaining from it. There is no "profit" in either design. There is maybe bragging rights if a third party actually builds a rifle and does something cool with the design. Bickering will result in no one using either design and letting the public know about it.

 

[hubel458]

Chamber reamer print is public domain, anybody in the world can use it, prints will
be at makers few days, if folks know how, they can make die/roughing
reamers also. Any questions please ask.. We have two guys already going to neck
the cases for themselves,, and we are doing it. ...2 others ordered some already, Ed.

 

[hubel458]

Mr fmajor, uh I was supplying cases, and losing little on everyone that we'd sell..