Is there some thing wrong with my seating die.
- Thread starter WildBillG
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Bullet tips are not very reliable. Until you have a good comparator then you really have no way of knowing. .015 is a very small measurement although important. Even with a comparator there is a learning curve to get a consistent measurement.
My measuring the Hornady's got me wanting to see if other companies changed bullet length that much. My Barnes 150gr TTSX in .284 varied about.010 and actually only one bullet was out that much the rest were .005. Then I tried some .284 Nosler E Tips 140 grainers and they were only .003 difference. This tells me more could be done on quality control some where I think. When we have variances in bullet length where is it coming from it can't be just in the tip. If it is in the taper how can we seat bullets correctly at all. If it is in the taper that could change where the ogive of the bullet is. Saying .015 isn't that much tends not to make sense when we adjust seating depths in .005 increments. I have seen the difference .005 can make in a group it can be quite a bit. The hollow point Bergers I measued did not change as much as the tipped ELDX did. Hollow points are supposed to be terrible to measure to tip length. So out of curiosity where do VLD seater stems push when seating a bullet. Is it on the taper or the ogive.
aushunter1
Well-Known Member
Imo its your neck tension variances from case to case.
Annealing will help but you do really need to measure from the ogive not the tip so 1st thing I would be doing is getting a comparator.
This will ensure you are the same distance to the lands each time, the projectile tip to projectile base length is not as important & yes it will vary. no projectile make would be able to make a projectile to be exact every time unless maybe if they are turned on a lathe, even then there would be minute differences.
Annealing will help but you do really need to measure from the ogive not the tip so 1st thing I would be doing is getting a comparator.
This will ensure you are the same distance to the lands each time, the projectile tip to projectile base length is not as important & yes it will vary. no projectile make would be able to make a projectile to be exact every time unless maybe if they are turned on a lathe, even then there would be minute differences.
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MNbogboy
Well-Known Member
Keep in mind that the COAL is not as important as the CBTO. In your case the cartridge base to ogive is most likely way closer than you think. The bullet base to ogive is usually more consistent than the overall bullet length. As long as your bullet seating stem is not pushing on the bullet tip you will get variances in the overall cartridge length. This stresses the importance of measuring cartridges at the ogive and not relying on COAL as in common reloading manuals. Each comparator measurement is a relative measurement based on your equipment & tools, so as a result manuals do not publish this information.
Quality bullets will vary more in OAL than BTO, without any other measurements or tools if you allowed "long" bullets to seat at a longer cartridge length you probably are in good shape. Seating long bullets to match other cartridges may be a mistake (unless for maintaining maximum magazine length).
My .02,
Randy
aushunter1
Well-Known Member
4 basic pieces of equipment so many reloaders don't think they need until they start having issues.
1. Decent calipers
2. Oal gauge with modified case-to measure any projectiles distance from the lands
3. Headspace gauge-to measure your datum line & help set up your dies accordingly
4. Comparators-to be to measure your CTBO of a loaded cartridge(or just projectiles if your that pedantic)
Plenty of 'poor mans' methods you will find on the internet for sure but if your reloading don't be a scrooge!
If you cant buy those things from the onset of your reloading journey then don't start.
Its a harsh reality, do the research & obtain the right knowledge & equipment before you begin, its not that hard
1. Decent calipers
2. Oal gauge with modified case-to measure any projectiles distance from the lands
3. Headspace gauge-to measure your datum line & help set up your dies accordingly
4. Comparators-to be to measure your CTBO of a loaded cartridge(or just projectiles if your that pedantic)
Plenty of 'poor mans' methods you will find on the internet for sure but if your reloading don't be a scrooge!
If you cant buy those things from the onset of your reloading journey then don't start.
Its a harsh reality, do the research & obtain the right knowledge & equipment before you begin, its not that hard
Aushunter1 I think it is more us guys wanting to shoot long range who will need the comparator. I got by for 30 some years without one it is only now that I am getting insanely fussy that I need it. The Canadian economy would break me if I buy modified cases for all of my center fire rifles.
aushunter1
Well-Known Member
WBG, modified cases are like $5 each & the other gear not very expensive either.
I don't mean to be rude but what accuracy did you think was a minimum in those 30 years??
No offence but what was an acceptable standard 30 years ago doesn't always equate to standards of modern times.
Saying 'got me by' to wanting 1/2moa accuracy match grade projectiles is like chalk & cheese.
Which are you after??
I only started reloading in 2008 so I think I am still a novice compared to many but in the 1st bits of reloading gear I bought was all of the about.
Why?
Because I read about reloading & what is needed to give very good self made ammo.
I continue to stay in touch with processes & gear as the years go by.
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I think we both know that most hunters and reloaders out there are happy if they get 1.25 inch groups. I how ever was always after the best I could get from my reloads and put a lot of effort into achieving that. After I shot a .179 inch group with my Sako 6PPC that became my standard. That was achieved with out conparator or modified case technology. All I had was a caliper and a slightly neck sized case to create that load. I am going to get a comparator now but to tell the honest truth I had never heard of one until 2 years ago. That said most of my rifles have loads worked up that shoot .500 to .750 pretty regularly. In fact it was only a few months ago I even thought about shoulder bumping my cases. All I have done is neck size and every once in a while full length resize. Some times old school stuff works why do you think they still use Land Cruisers in Africa.
aushunter1
Well-Known Member
You mean why do they still use 1980 Landcruiser's in Africa?
Because that's all a 3rd world country can afford!
I will just refer back to my 1st post...……. neck tension/annealing
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aushunter1
Well-Known Member
Duplicate
Just so everyone knows I am not against change and advancements. It is just that this is first time I have ever noticed this issue. It probably happened before and I never noticed it. Things are easier to pick up when you are working in smaller volumesand maybe reading forums tomuch. Any way I have to buy a new gadget now no big deal.
