How well does the average big game hunter shoot?

[Turkeytider]

Soooo....If I pay my money and show up and say " I want to take that 500 yard shot" at an elk, I don`t have to prove to the outfitter that I can make that shot EFFECTIVELY? I assume that on most hunts, a guide is present?

 

[birddog 68]

Soooo....If I pay my money and show up and say " I want to take that 500 yard shot" at an elk, I don`t have to prove to the outfitter that I can make that shot EFFECTIVELY? I assume that on most hunts, a guide is present?

Every guided hunt that I have been on the guide wants to see you shoot at targets at different ranges so they can get a idea of your ability. They don't want you to wound a animal for the same reason you don't plus it adds way more work for them if it's not DRT.

 

[CMP70306]

Soooo....If I pay my money and show up and say " I want to take that 500 yard shot" at an elk, I don`t have to prove to the outfitter that I can make that shot EFFECTIVELY? I assume that on most hunts, a guide is present?

Every guided hunt that I have been on the guide wants to see you shoot at targets at different ranges so they can get a idea of your ability. They don't want you to wound a animal for the same reason you don't plus it adds way more work for them if it's not DRT.

Only been on two hunts, a pig hunt in SC and a Bison hunt in NE. The pig hunt they put us in a stand and said have at it with zero confirmation of our shooting skills.

For the Bison hunt however the guide stated we needed to shoot prior to hunting in order to make sure the zero didn't shift while traveling. In reality he was doing it primarily to see how I handled the firearm as well as my accuracy prior to the hunt to get an idea of my familiarity with the rifles I was hunting with. I only had to shoot steel at 100 yards to confirm as we weren't going to be shooting far and a bison is a big target and he doesn't want the clients shooting over 200 yards.

 

[Mark37082]

Some are blessed to have a 1000+ yard range very close to their home. Some are not. I primarily hunt in TN and the longest shot I've made on a deer was approximately 400 yards. It was a crouched shot off my pack where I had only 30 seconds or so to setup. I had ranged the hill side on this power line earlier and did not have time to dial the elevation before the shot. I was going to pass until my scope just settled perfectly on the broadside deer. I knew where to hold based on practice. I would not consider myself a great shooter by any means. I know my limitations and will pass when I'm not comfortable and confident in the shot. Now if there is a coyote out beyond my comfort range and I am certain of the backstop, I will let her rip. My longest kill was in Texas (1000+), but I have to admit it was pure luck other than knowing the range and basic dope. Dead coyote. I won't bore you with all my misses when shooting at long range varmints.
One thing that puzzles me is all the talk about DRT. Sure I have had a couple of deer drop in their tracks, but we must have special deer here. I've blown their hearts apart, and they have made a 50 yard death dash to the deepest ravine or thickest briar patch in the county.

 

[tony d willIiams]

I was on an elk hunt in NM year before last. One guy shows up with a Gunwerks rifle in 28N and could not stop talking about what a long range killer it was. My guide said he missed twice at 200, then wounded the elk and it wasn't recovered. His hunt was over. The next year, same thing. Guy shows up with a "long range rifle" and talks about how it is deadly out to "x" (I can't remember the exact range) yards. Wounded an elk at 500+ yards.

I suspect a lot of long range fans practice prone at targets that never move, etc., but fail to practice on much more likely shots, e.g., 200 yards away from a "not so steady" position. If you ever go to Africa, for example, practice standing off the sticks, because that is likely what you will be using. Unless you are hunting sheep in Alaska, you won't be shooting prone.

Thank you.
Sad for misses by "trained long range" shooters. Especially the wounded that got away, to die slowly.

Having a bunch of decades on me, a few hardy diseases, I regularly shoot off two sticks tied together with a rubber strap. I cannot hold my rifle up and steady as I was able to when young.

I am in process of making many DOPE sheets. The parallel makes a large difference, as does the direction of target. N/S/E/W.

I am learning, and having a blast. I reload so it is affordable. Even when retired.
Wish the armed services would have accepted me back in the '70s. The USA pocketbook is larger than mine.

 

[LRNut]

Only been on two hunts, a pig hunt in SC and a Bison hunt in NE. The pig hunt they put us in a stand and said have at it with zero confirmation of our shooting skills.

For the Bison hunt however the guide stated we needed to shoot prior to hunting in order to make sure the zero didn't shift while traveling. In reality he was doing it primarily to see how I handled the firearm as well as my accuracy prior to the hunt to get an idea of my familiarity with the rifles I was hunting with. I only had to shoot steel at 100 yards to confirm as we weren't going to be shooting far and a bison is a big target and he doesn't want the clients shooting over 200 yards.

A while ago I had a partner in Austria that resold our software; he took me on a pig hunt on one of my visits. His brother came along with a double rifle and was all excited during the four hour ride. I borrowed the guide's rifle. Before the hunt, we had to pass a shooting test; wasn't very difficult - I think a paper plate at 75 yards or so from a rest. My partner's brother flunked and wasn't allowed to hunt.

 

[CMP70306]

A while ago I had a partner in Austria that resold our software; he took me on a pig hunt on one of my visits. His brother came along with a double rifle and was all excited during the four hour ride. I borrowed the guide's rifle. Before the hunt, we had to pass a shooting test; wasn't very difficult - I think a paper plate at 75 yards or so from a rest. My partner's brother flunked and wasn't allowed to hunt.

Well that sucks, always helps to bring a back up that you are comfortable using. Case in point for my bison hunt I went with an 1874 Sharps but also brought my suppressed .300 Win Mag just in case we couldn't get close enough to get it done.

 

[mnoland30]

Plinker147, I can tell you that 50 years ago in NM, a hunter "scoped" me with his rifle, fortunately he decided I wasn't a deer, so he picked up his Budweiser and had a drink (they hadn't invented Bud Light yet).

I took two hunters for aoudad last year. One did a sitting shot off the back of another hunter at 200 yards and took out the front leg. Four shots later, the ram was dead. The second hunter took an offhand shot at 150. Aimed for the heart and hit it in the head.

I never took a shot over 100 yards for the first 10 years I hunted. The range in Tucson was limited to 200 yards, so it was a long time before I tried more than that. What made longer shots possible for me was a rangefinder.

 

[Turkeytider]

Plinker147, I can tell you that 50 years ago in NM, a hunter "scoped" me with his rifle, fortunately he decided I wasn't a deer, so he picked up his Budweiser and had a drink (they hadn't invented Bud Light yet).

I took two hunters for aoudad last year. One did a sitting shot off the back of another hunter at 200 yards and took out the front leg. Four shots later, the ram was dead. The second hunter took an offhand shot at 150. Aimed for the heart and hit it in the head.

I never took a shot over 100 yards for the first 10 years I hunted. The range in Tucson was limited to 200 yards, so it was a long time before I tried more than that. What made longer shots possible for me was a rangefinder.

Some people have no business with firearms. At least not shooting at anything alive. Sorry, just how I feel when I see/hear things like that.

 

[Chadp82]

Mnoland, it's interesting you mention range finder.

It occurred to me that growing up we shot under 200. Now with a range finder I feel comfortable shooting longer distances.

I wonder if the idea that people know how long the shot is and have the data for drop, it has increased confidence in shooters in general and they are normal tools in the field, where 25 years ago they were more rare. Heck, I remember a couple deer I missed before I had a rangefinder because we could not afford them when I was younger. we practiced A LOT on the field 3D range at the local sportsman club and didn't look at the yardage until after we shot to practice judging distance.

To some degree I think this gives some people a false sense they can shoot much further by holdover or adjusting a turret even though they don't practice out that far.

 

[Ruger4570]

I am a Firearms Instructor at the S.O. Range and we have a Hunter Sight in day every year before hunting season. In addition to that, we have a public shooting day the first and second Thursday of every month. Shooting from sandbags off of a bench, most people can't shoot a three inch group. They come with equipment in awful shape, with a WalMart scope on a 7mm mag that won't group at all. Again, this is off of sand bags off of a concrete bench. A hodgepodge of ammunition, different brands and bullet weights. They shoot as fast as they can chamber another round regardless of what we instruct them to do. A six inch group at 100 yards, and they want to start cranking on the adjustment turrets not having any idea about shooting a "group", then moving the group. They shoot 5 more rounds into a worse group, then crank on the adjustment turrets. At the end of the session, if the shots are anywhere on a sight-in target at 100 yards, they proclaim: "That's good enough". They then throw their rifle into the bed of their pickup and drive away. Most have no ammo left, and say they are heading to Cabelas or WalMart to get more ammo, not realizing they need the same brand and bullet weight they are sighted in with, but realistically wouldn't matter the way they are shooting. Of course we have exceptions to the above where someone will show up with a rifle already sighted in and shoot a nice 3/4 inch group two inches high at 100 yards. BUT that's not very often but it does happen.

I have help sightvin at the gun club I use. Same thing. Will bring new rifle with scope one box of ammo . Shoot till three rounds left ,maybe. Then they leave.. Next year they complain they missed because the rifle was off .

 

[frostop]

Interesting thread, too long to read through all the comments.

About 30 years ago I went hunting with some acquaintances, walked down a logging road before daylight stopped and set up on a log deck out on a point overlooking a large clearing. Keep in mind this was back when there were elk everywhere. As it got lighter I could see what I thought were stumps, as it got lighter I noticed that those stumps had moved. Realizing that those stumps were in fact elk, I set up and took a couple shots with no affect. The next weekend I walked down another log road and saw a couple elk at what I thought was 3-400 yds, set up and took a shot with no affect.

This was when I pulled my head out of my behind and decided that I didn't necessarily need to learn to shoot but learn exactly what my rifle was doing at the different yardages, I also started handloading pretty heavily mainly for the consistency. It's funny, today and I look back at those shots that would be simple today with all the practice and field time that I have put in over the years. Just this morning I was at the range and connecting at 400yds very easily (trajectory validation).

Up to that point I was one of those guys that would go to whitefront and buy a box of the cheapest dear ammo, go to the range and fire a few to make sure I was on at 100 yds and call it good!

In my eyes the animals deserve that "we" do everything possible to be as humane as possible and make a one shot kill. Yes sometimes good plans turn to doodoo, but we have to do our part!

 

[R. Cram]

I consistently shoot sub MOA off a bench. But shooting off a bench at a range is a whole lot different to shooting in the field. To be proficient you need to practice shooting from a range of different field positions: standing supported (monopod, shooting sticks, trees, etc) and off-hand, kneeling, sitting, prone, etc.

I think shooting off a bench is a waste of ammunition and barrel life unless your hobby is going to be bench rest shooting. I have never seen a bench at a military range and I am sure not going to pack a bench out in the field hunting. almost all hunters will sight in off a bench and never shoot any other position and are very dismall shots. My range here at my home does not have a bench and to check loads I shoot off my elbow with a sling. Untill I started shooting highpower I thought slings were for carrying a rifle and I'll bet 99 out of 100 hunters have never seen them used to shoot. the old saying is hunters don't shoot and shooters don't hunt is true all to often. This new infatuation with shooting long range hunting should not be used by 99 % of hunters, they will not spend the time learning what the wind looks like and how to compensate for it they think you just put in the come ups and make long shots but as any one who has shot a lot at long ranges the wind is the whole game and here I have never been out hunting without some wind. I have tryed many times to get people around here to come to a match so someone will be pulling the target after each shot so the shooter can see the wind effect for each shot as he fires usually the wind correction is different for each shot as you get past 600 yds. any body wanting to take advantage of this oppurtunity there will be a match the second Saturday in September in Vale, oregon near Boise, Idaho which will be F class or NRA highpower prone 20 shots at 600, 20 at 800, 20 at 900, and 20 at 1000. I feel sorry for guides as I have tryed to help buddies get on a deer and made some good runs on them only to have them miss, I bet the average hunter couldn't hit a pie plate 3 times in a row in a field position at 100 yds. Once while antelope hunting we had one of us needing to fill his tag so a farmer gave us permission to hunt his place. Out in a field was a buck about 150 yds away with a loafing shed at the edge of the field, we crawled up on the sloping roof and crept to the edge where he could lay down and shoot and not be seen ,we were urging him to shoot and he would and miss we would say shoot again and he would and miss again this went on for about 7 or 8 shots and the buck just stayed there, I was just about to jump off the roof to get more ammo when one of his shots accidently hit the buck in the neck. The farmer came by in about 5 minutes and said I see you got one most people can't hit them, he probably heard all the shooting.

 

[R. Cram]

the safe bet for shooting at 600 ,as you know is to shoot in the same condition but is a lot more fun to try to shoot on changes and beat the wind or try to