Do I understand the "node" ?

[AlphaDogs]

- Go to loading book
- Pick cartridge, bullet & powder
- Load one round each starting at "start" ending at "maximum", 1/2 gr apart
- Shoot these on a target
- Note the bullet strikes
- the 3 that group the closest represent the node

 

[rsmithsr]

no

 

[rsmithsr]

1/2 gr is way too much for a small case
try 1/100 of case volume for each step.
I would use load software over book data,
you can adjust for YOUR RIFLE as in bbl length, cartridge length, case volume.
velocity is part of the process, not just holes on a target. lack of vertical is more important than a little left right.... where was the wind coming from.

 

[25WSM]

Depending on the cartridge your loading . 5 might be ok to find the node. But when I do my Satterlee test I usually use .2 increments. If you are looking at paper only try to do it at least 300 yards. If using a chrono doesn't matter. Look up satterlee load development on YouTube. It the method I use to find the node. Then I use seating depth to fine tune the accuracy.
Shep

 

[aushunter1]

- Go to loading book
- Pick cartridge, bullet & powder
- Load one round each starting at "start" ending at "maximum", 1/2 gr apart
- Shoot these on a target
- Note the bullet strikes
- the 3 that group the closest represent the node

A node is where a given load is in timing with the barrel harmonics.

How you get it there or how you determine if this is achieved is up to interpretation.

Here is some reading for you

Optimal Barrel Time Concept

RSI - General Reloading Tips

Barrel Harmonics, Timing & Theory

www.shootingsoftware.com

This could & more often than not happens more than once is a round of load development, most people would be looking for a node in the higher end of the scale to try & get better velocity but when it comes down to it just finding the most accurate is what I try to obtain.

Finding a node(or nodes) is just part of obtaining a satisfactory load, there is usually a bit of tweaking involved after you find them.

 

[AlphaDogs]

Wow, that's a lot to digest.

I like you am interested in accuracy. As best i can understand my "system" will produce the most accurate load.

If velocity is important, I have found sometimes a maximum load will give high velocity as well as acceptable accuracy.

I've found you don't have to try every powder listed to find the best. Borrowing from others experiences is a good shortcut. An example is the 6.5 Creedmore where reading said 4064 or 4350. Sure enough both produced 1/2-3/4" groups with 140 gr Match bullets. With 4350 the author had tried a range of loads. I just took his best and got matching results from a budget Ruger American.

 

[Tiny Tim]

Its a good start. Some powder/ bullet combos just don't work in a particular rifle and we have to "listen" to an individual rifle. Many opinions, many methods to get there. Some better, some worse. You define the goal and pick a method that works for your situation. I spend alot less time on load development for a "woods" rifle than a long range precision rifle. Your method sounds like the OCW (Optimal Charge Weight) method and works well for its intended purpose.

 

[Savage 12BVSS]

A high node will often shoot just as well as a lower velocity node and give's you the benefit of velocity along with accuracy, thats a deadly combo. Agree that trying every powder suggested to give you a total picture of what the rifle likes. Fine tuning the node with small changes in distance to lands and powder charge along with primers will dial you in the final steps to a perfect load.

 

[tlbrush]

You can think of it like being on a teeter totter...when you are at the top or the bottom you are stationary for a moment. When your barrel oscillates, at the top and bottom of each oscillation it is stationary. Unlike the teeter totter example the oscillation is rounded at the top and bottom so side of the directional change the movement up and down becomes less and less so you have a little bit wider moment where the barrel is barely moving up or down so the bullets will tend to impact near the same vertical location.

 

[Flintlock shooter]

Keep in mind that most people think the "node" is based on vibration. It seems however that the "node" is actually a velocity node. When you talk with others that are shooting the same cartridge/bullet, pay attention to what they say about their velocity. You will normally find that your rifle will probably end up shooting at or near that velocity.

 

[smokey3]

Keep in mind that most people think the "node" is based on vibration. It seems however that the "node" is actually a velocity node. When you talk with others that are shooting the same cartridge/bullet, pay attention to what they say about their velocity. You will normally find that your rifle will probably end up shooting at or near that velocity.

Is it possible that the vibration of the barrel and the velocity node happen to coincide? I don't know the answer, merely asking a question. There are many articles about the vibration and oscillation of the barrel being related to sound waves. I do know some 1000 yard benchrest shooters who say exactly what you stated about the velocity node, however I am wondering if the vibration and velocity nodes are related? Before anyone jumps all over me, remember I am only curious about this, I am in no way saying one or the other is the correct answer. If anyone else has an opinion on this subject, please feel free to give your opinion, after all, most of us are on this forum to learn and hear other people's opinions. Is it possible that some barrel twists, calibers, and bullet weights just like being spun along at a certain speed? IMO, the answer is yes.

 

[DucNutz]

My understanding of "the node" was that it was timing the exit of the projectile out of the barrel (adjusting that timing with the projectiles velocity) while the barrel vibration was at the breech and not the muzzle...