Clicking out to 500m .. options?

[Porker]

Hi all, been lurking to long again, but did pop in here at times for some good reads from the experienced mob..

Long story short... Finding that with both my Leupold's with LR duplex and Varmint reticles, i'm not as accurate aiming from the lower crosshairs/dots as i'm from the main crosshair. I'm considering the Leupold CDS option to therefore mostly shoot from the main crosshair. My goal is to become as proficient as possible field position hunting at 500m max... either off sticks out to 300m and field prone with back pack further to 500m. Been practicing judging distance/wind drift as that would be the telling factor as i'm not one for carrying a range finder all day...

1)Anyone gone this route? Any other click ajustment systems that really work? Prefer to stick to Leupold as I dont want to start all over laying out cash for new scopes.

2) Since your stuck with the one projectile you select, any problems with inaccurate BC's? I'm considering Nosler AB's but heard that their BC's are a bit inflated, fearing that this would affect accurate "dialing in" due to distorted data given to Leupold. shooting 338wm and 6.5 swede only.

Would appreciate some sound advise guys!

 

[WeiserBucks]

If you're going to shoot beyond what we call a chip shot , you need a range finder . Guessing the range and shooting at game is a mistake in my opinion. You don't need a CDS turret , you need a range finder and a lot more respect for the critters that you are hunting .

 

[Porker]

point taken... but even with a range finder i still need to equate that to hold over in the scope and a CDS system would probably be better for me than holding on the smaller crosshairs/dots?

 

[codyadams]

If you are shooting at coyotes, ground squirrels, prairie dogs, or other varmints, then guessing range is perfectly acceptable, though you will likely not be as successful.

Now I'm not stating you are, but if you try to hunt big game and want to guess at ranges over 300-400 yards....honestly that would give the rest of the long range community a very poor image, because it is just plain unethical and very poor hunting practice in general. 500 yards is too far to guess. Hell, 300 yards is too far to guess with standard calibers. A deer at 300 yards vs 375 yards is going to be hard to decipher, especially in uncertain terrain, and it WILL make a difference in your hold with your 338 and 6.5x55. Even guessing on the upper end of your point blank range can get you in trouble, if you think it's 250ish but it's really 280, you either miss (the BEST outcome) or you wound it by hitting the lower brisket. And farther than that only gets more challenging, and if you want to make ethical, humane shots, you WILL NOT accomplish this every time by estimating your range, and if you can't do it first shot every time, don't do it. So if you are considering stretching out to 500 yards or more and estimating on range, please do not do this.

Bottom line, if you plan on shooting farther at big game than you can hold on fur and shoot, you NEED to get a rangefinder to be ethical, and it even helps if you do not plan on shooting past 250-300 yards. SIG has their 2200 for under $500 that will range as far as any ethical hunter would shoot, so it's not out of reach. Shooting long range, despite what a lot of long range advertising says, is NOT easy, and it takes work, practice, time, and yes, some money investment. And to be honest, if someone is not willing to put in the work, it is negligent for them to attempt it in a hunting scenario.

Now that that is out of the way.....as far as the CDS dial, I have played with one and it is not terrible, but it has some limitations. As you stated, if your info is not perfect, then your turret will be incorrect to begin with, and even with correct info, I have found that I need to tweak the numbers in my ballistic calculator at times to get them to match up with my observed drops perfectly. Also, with a CDS, you cannot switch your load and use that turret as easily. My personal preference is just your basic MOA or MIL numbered scope, it will jive with any load should you change, and can be put on different rifles without needing a new turret made. If you're not the type to carry your phone or ballistic calculator with you, then you can print out drop/wind charts for the areas/atmospheric conditions you plan to hunt in.

But if your really set on the CDS dial system, the best option is to find your load first, then go out and shoot your ranges to confirm drop (you need a rangefinder to do this) and that way you can give them accurate numbers to make your turret.

I do agree that dialing is more precise than hold over, as you have an exact point to aim. If I'm shooting at a target at 390 yards, I dial my turret to 4.25, and aim right on. If I'm shooting at 685, I dial my turret to 11 and hold right on. It is the same no matter the distance, my ballistics calculator tells me how many MOA to dial, I dial it, and hold on. I still must figure out the wind speed and direction and add that to my equation, you can hold off or dial your windage (I dial if I have time), and if I dope my wind properly, I know with my rifle I will make a good hit. Last year I took a pronghorn at 876, and my cousin used my rifle to take a deer at 925, both first round impacts/kills. That kind of consistency and confidence is awesome, but it takes work and a lot of rounds down range.

 

[Porker]

phew .. at least I now know that most of you are not super human and use range finders at even closer ranges. I have not lost an animal yet but came pretty close with a longish shot on a blesbuck in Africa, where I shot him a little behind having not accounted for wind. Range was given by the guide (not using rangefinder) at aprox 300m, on foot it took me a couple of hours to find him and settle things ... I have been fairly successful out to 300m on fox with my 243 (sold) without a rangefinder, mainly going on MPBR, but even foxes need to be taken humanly i feel.

I will have to incorporate my Redfield rangfinder as hunting tool from now on since i'm looking at deer, goat and pig's ... definitely set on the CDS system but i will follow your advice and shoot my load extensively before I submit data

 

[codyadams]

definitely set on the CDS system but i will follow your advice and shoot my load extensively before I submit data

That is what I would do. Zero your load where you want it zeroed, then shoot at say 300, 400, 500 and 600 if you can go that far, and figure out exactly how much adjustment it takes to make solid centered impacts at said ranges. Give this data to Leupold and they should be able to make you a good turret. Just keep in mind, If you hunt at a location 2,000 ft elevation or more different than where you set up your turret, your turret will be off, and impacts will be higher at higher elevation, and lower at lower elevation. As long as you keep in mind the limitation of a CDS dial (when not combined with a rangefinder like the G7 or a ballistics app) then you will have a very nice and reliable set up.

 

[Porker]

Cody, do I simply count clicks out to the diff ranges 200,300 from the base 100 zero and submit to Leupold? So if it's 7 clicks to 200... another 5 to 300 etc?