Bedding Blocks
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Dan Conzo
Well-Known Member
At Williamsport on the the 16 1/2 lb class there are some blocks on the rifles but just actions (sleeved, custom and Rem) seem to be more prevalent--the blocks (aluminum) are usually just ahead of he receiver about 5 3/4 to 5 7/8 inches long, most are flat on bottom with three guard screws evenly spaced and pillar bedded, blocks vary in width from about 1 5/8 inch to 2 inches. The bottom half on back of the block is the recoil lug. The sides are tapered from center to bottom about 2 degrees and the front (from center to bottom) is tapered about 10 degrees to facilitate removal from stock.
Dan Conzo
Well-Known Member
I forgot--yes no action contact.
Thanks for the reply Dan.
So the bottom of the block has a recoil lug milled in? My concern/perspective, again from someone with no experience- is I'd want that block NOT to move on it's screws. Is the lower half of the block bedded tight to the stock? Imagine there's various methods of setting a BB system up.
So the bottom of the block has a recoil lug milled in? My concern/perspective, again from someone with no experience- is I'd want that block NOT to move on it's screws. Is the lower half of the block bedded tight to the stock? Imagine there's various methods of setting a BB system up.
Steve Shelp
Well-Known Member
Aladin,
Dan's right on. Everything outside the block is 100% free floating.
To answer your question on how the are bedded.... normally at the very least the bottom of the block or sleeve is glass bedded into the stock and has screws applied in pillars out of steel or aluminum. My original block gun has the bottom of the brass block permanantly glued into the stock.
As for the recoil lug, your block or sleeve is the recoil lug itself once it's clamped or glued to the barrel.
I've got digital pictures of my setups (glued sleeve and barrel block) on my home computer. I'll try and post them later tonight if your interested.
Steve
Dan's right on. Everything outside the block is 100% free floating.
To answer your question on how the are bedded.... normally at the very least the bottom of the block or sleeve is glass bedded into the stock and has screws applied in pillars out of steel or aluminum. My original block gun has the bottom of the brass block permanantly glued into the stock.
As for the recoil lug, your block or sleeve is the recoil lug itself once it's clamped or glued to the barrel.
I've got digital pictures of my setups (glued sleeve and barrel block) on my home computer. I'll try and post them later tonight if your interested.
Steve
Steve Shelp
Well-Known Member
Aladin,
I've got a 2 day match I'm going to in VA this weekend and I've got to weigh all of my charges and sort bullets for both guns. Plus I'm not sure what time I'll be getting out of work tonight. What I'm saying is if I don't get them posted tonight, I'll be back Sunday evening and post the pictures at that time. sorry, there's only so much time in one day.
Talk to you later,
Steve
I've got a 2 day match I'm going to in VA this weekend and I've got to weigh all of my charges and sort bullets for both guns. Plus I'm not sure what time I'll be getting out of work tonight. What I'm saying is if I don't get them posted tonight, I'll be back Sunday evening and post the pictures at that time. sorry, there's only so much time in one day.
Talk to you later,
Steve
Steve Shelp
Well-Known Member
Aladin,
Well I just got done with work a little bit ago, so as usual I'm running late on getting these pictures posted for you. Anyway here they are. Hope they aren't too big and take a long time to download
This picture shows a brass split block that the bottom half is glued into the stock without any screws at all. This rifle was glued together in '77. Been that way ever sinse.
same as above but with the barreled action in the block. This was trying to show how the action and the front (unturned) portion of the barrel is 100% free floating. It only takes about 4in/# on each of the 1/4-20 screws to hold this barreled action in place.
The barrel section that is turned down is what has been lapped into this block. If the barreled action ever slid under recoil, it would stop as soon as the front shoulder of the turned down barrel hit the front of the block.
This is on of my other HG style long range guns with a glued on sleeve around the barrel and glass bedded into the stock with (3) 5/16-18 screws with steel inserts bedded into the stock as shown.
closeup of the steel inserts and guard screws bedded into the bottom of the forearm.
The barreled action with the glued sleeve showing the (3) screws that hold the sleeve in the stock. The sleeve is glued to the barrel. There are no screws in the barrel or the action at all and again the front of the barrel and action are 100% floated. When you want to rebarrel, you heat the steel sleeve and press it out on a good hydraulic press. Takes a little bit but it will come out. This barrel/sleeve has been glued together for approx 10+yrs without a problem.
hopes this helps with some of your questions. If not feel free to ask away. Myself or the others can help.
Steve
[ 05-28-2002: Message edited by: Steve Shelp ]
Well I just got done with work a little bit ago, so as usual I'm running late on getting these pictures posted for you. Anyway here they are. Hope they aren't too big and take a long time to download
This picture shows a brass split block that the bottom half is glued into the stock without any screws at all. This rifle was glued together in '77. Been that way ever sinse.
same as above but with the barreled action in the block. This was trying to show how the action and the front (unturned) portion of the barrel is 100% free floating. It only takes about 4in/# on each of the 1/4-20 screws to hold this barreled action in place.
The barrel section that is turned down is what has been lapped into this block. If the barreled action ever slid under recoil, it would stop as soon as the front shoulder of the turned down barrel hit the front of the block.
This is on of my other HG style long range guns with a glued on sleeve around the barrel and glass bedded into the stock with (3) 5/16-18 screws with steel inserts bedded into the stock as shown.
closeup of the steel inserts and guard screws bedded into the bottom of the forearm.
The barreled action with the glued sleeve showing the (3) screws that hold the sleeve in the stock. The sleeve is glued to the barrel. There are no screws in the barrel or the action at all and again the front of the barrel and action are 100% floated. When you want to rebarrel, you heat the steel sleeve and press it out on a good hydraulic press. Takes a little bit but it will come out. This barrel/sleeve has been glued together for approx 10+yrs without a problem.
hopes this helps with some of your questions. If not feel free to ask away. Myself or the others can help.
Steve
[ 05-28-2002: Message edited by: Steve Shelp ]
texas
Well-Known Member
Now are you guys blocking just competition gun and or your hunting rifles? If your hunting guns how and how much?
Steve Shelp
Well-Known Member
Texas,
Most of the HG style guns whether they be competition or hunting rigs with the long barrels are blocked and/or sleeved now. It eliminates the need for the big custom actions, and essentially gives you a shorter stiffer barrel while maintaining the long lengths. It also has the added benefit of giving you a place to mount the externally mounted scopes such as the Unertls you see pictured above without touching the action. So in using this setup the only thing that touches the action is the trigger and that is free hanging. So you litterly make the action a place to lock your bolt down into and hang the firing mechanism..... That's it. So the stress is non-existant on the action. Then you take a 40" barrel and hang it from a 9" or 10" block and your shooting the same stiffness of a 30" barrel really with no stress on the action.
HG style hunting and competition guns that I've dealt with are blocked/sleeved the same way. Now if your talking a carry rifle then you normally back off on the barrel length some and do a conventional piller bedding job with 30-34" barrel lengths to save some weight. But some have blocked these lighter weight rifles also in the 13-15# range. These blocks are a little different in shape and setup but they do the same function. One thing you need to consider is the height of the line of sight on heavier recoiling rifles. If the scope is to high to get the bell to clear the barrel block your going to have the racoon look after firing the big boomers without a much taller comb on the stock to help roll with the recoil. This again adds weight. So everything is a compromise when using one on a carry rifle.
Most blocks run from 6"->12" with 9"-10" being the norm. Bruce Baer swears by the 9" block based on his experiments.
Crow Mag,
In the late '80s/early '90s in competition guns the glued sleeve method was probably the majority (that's debatable), but the swing lately has been to split blocks I would say in HG class. Due to the weight restrictions in the Light Gun class most don't use a barrel block or sleeves in that class. As far as which method is more accurate? .... when done properly I don't think either has the advantage. The split block makes it easier to switch barrels and less cost for gunsmithing when rebarreling due to not having to knock the barrel out of the glued sleeve.
This leads me to your second question. Depending on your rifle setup yes you can have a switch barrel combination using a split block. But it depends on how your scope is mounted (action or block) and a few other thing that dictate how time comsuming it would be to switch one out. Myself I went with a big custom action to hang my barrel out there full floating to have the switch barrel combo in my competition HG. Takes me 10 minutes max from pulling the trigger on one barrel to pulling the trigger on the second barrel. And that's not really hurrying. But again that is without a block.
Hope this answers your questions. Sorry for the delay in replying, work has been a bear lately! Anyone have a good bear load?
to the others, your welcome. No big deal. Had them archived on the computer. Just had to copy them up and link them... in my free time.
Steve
[ 06-02-2002: Message edited by: Steve Shelp ]
Most of the HG style guns whether they be competition or hunting rigs with the long barrels are blocked and/or sleeved now. It eliminates the need for the big custom actions, and essentially gives you a shorter stiffer barrel while maintaining the long lengths. It also has the added benefit of giving you a place to mount the externally mounted scopes such as the Unertls you see pictured above without touching the action. So in using this setup the only thing that touches the action is the trigger and that is free hanging. So you litterly make the action a place to lock your bolt down into and hang the firing mechanism..... That's it. So the stress is non-existant on the action. Then you take a 40" barrel and hang it from a 9" or 10" block and your shooting the same stiffness of a 30" barrel really with no stress on the action.
HG style hunting and competition guns that I've dealt with are blocked/sleeved the same way. Now if your talking a carry rifle then you normally back off on the barrel length some and do a conventional piller bedding job with 30-34" barrel lengths to save some weight. But some have blocked these lighter weight rifles also in the 13-15# range. These blocks are a little different in shape and setup but they do the same function. One thing you need to consider is the height of the line of sight on heavier recoiling rifles. If the scope is to high to get the bell to clear the barrel block your going to have the racoon look after firing the big boomers without a much taller comb on the stock to help roll with the recoil. This again adds weight. So everything is a compromise when using one on a carry rifle.
Most blocks run from 6"->12" with 9"-10" being the norm. Bruce Baer swears by the 9" block based on his experiments.
Crow Mag,
In the late '80s/early '90s in competition guns the glued sleeve method was probably the majority (that's debatable), but the swing lately has been to split blocks I would say in HG class. Due to the weight restrictions in the Light Gun class most don't use a barrel block or sleeves in that class. As far as which method is more accurate? .... when done properly I don't think either has the advantage. The split block makes it easier to switch barrels and less cost for gunsmithing when rebarreling due to not having to knock the barrel out of the glued sleeve.
This leads me to your second question. Depending on your rifle setup yes you can have a switch barrel combination using a split block. But it depends on how your scope is mounted (action or block) and a few other thing that dictate how time comsuming it would be to switch one out. Myself I went with a big custom action to hang my barrel out there full floating to have the switch barrel combo in my competition HG. Takes me 10 minutes max from pulling the trigger on one barrel to pulling the trigger on the second barrel. And that's not really hurrying. But again that is without a block.
Hope this answers your questions. Sorry for the delay in replying, work has been a bear lately! Anyone have a good bear load?
to the others, your welcome. No big deal. Had them archived on the computer. Just had to copy them up and link them... in my free time.
Steve
[ 06-02-2002: Message edited by: Steve Shelp ]
