2nd test results. Thoughts??

[emn83]

so, I took Valkyrie out for another load test. I used 46.0 as my max load this time, because I had seen a very slight ejector mark on my brass at that weight last time. I made up 23 rounds at the following powder weights:

44.4gr (loaded 5 to use as sighters)
44.7
45.0
45.2
45.5
45.7
46.0

I shot a sighter target with the 44.4 gr to make sure I was at on POA/POA, I was close enough that I could do my test (less than half an inch difference POA/POI)


my test was a modified OCW test, I did not let the barrel completely cool between every shot

I shot 3 strings, letting the barrel cool between strings. The first and third string were shot in order by increasing powder weight. Because I wanted to make sure that barrel temp wasn't having a major part in my results, I reversed my firing order for the second string. I did not notice any pressure signs on any of my brass.

Outside temp was 32 degrees, I did all my shooting in just about an hour.

Here's my target

the target order goes:

44.7 45.0 45.2
45.5 45.7 46.0

There was one called flier on the 44.7 grouping.

Any thoughts on interpreting my shots?

 

[SBruce]

I am not seeing any appreciable shift in POI with charges from 45.2 through 45.7. Would you agree?

My understanding of OCW is we're looking for the middle of the range where we get no changes in POI, and then we adjust seating depth to fine tune and go for better grouping from there.

That being said, I guess if it were me; I'd reconfirm at 200 or 300 yds (assuming these were at 100) if results are the same, stick with 45.5 for a while and try seating depth changes next.

Others may interpret this differently.
Will be curious to hear how this works out as it progresses.

 

[emn83]

I am not seeing any appreciable shift in POI with charges from 45.2 through 45.7. Would you agree?

My understanding of OCW is we're looking for the middle of the range where we get no changes in POI, and then we adjust seating depth to fine tune and go for better grouping from there.

That's what I was thinking also. I let my self get caught up with group size, and 44.5 and 44.7 are bigger groups than 44.2 and 46.0. Looking at it, I think 45.5 will be the OCW, like you said.

I'm pretty new to reloading, having just started last spring, so I'm always on the look out for more advice, and to get other people's opinions

 

[Wile E Coyote]

The 45.0 group. 3 rounds in 2 holes. And those 2 holes are dispersed horizontally. Reload some at 45.0 and at 45.5 then go longer as SBruce says. See what ya get.

Just my thoughts.

 

[emn83]

The 45.0 group. 3 rounds in 2 holes. And those 2 holes are dispersed horizontally. Reload some at 45.0 and at 45.5 then go longer as SBruce says. See what ya get.

Just my thoughts.

thanks for the ideas! I hadn't thought about the fact that the 45.0 load had no vertical

 

[emn83]

So, I'm looking at trying the 45.0 load, and the 45.5 load again, this coming week, at 200 yards.is there another load I might want to try? Or should I just stick with those two?

 

[royinidaho]

In my simple mind, thinking that tuning loads is to enable more consistent game harvest, I don't see enough difference in any of the groups to make much difference. Assuming the shots were @ at least 100 yards.

200 yard shooting may reveal different results but I would doubt it.

If harvesting game is the goal (not wearing out the barrel squeezing fractions of an inch) I'd go with the highest velocity load. Thinking that wind is the worst enemy and time of flight would be the shortest.

Just my tho'ts.

 

[SBruce]

So, I'm looking at trying the 45.0 load, and the 45.5 load again, this coming week, at 200 yards.is there another load I might want to try? Or should I just stick with those two?

I'd also try the 45.2 again. It's a nicely shaped triangular group that could possibly be turned into a "one hole" group with seating depth adjustments.

 

[emn83]

In my simple mind, thinking that tuning loads is to enable more consistent game harvest, I don't see enough difference in any of the groups to make much difference. Assuming the shots were @ at least 100 yards.

200 yard shooting may reveal different results but I would doubt it.

If harvesting game is the goal (not wearing out the barrel squeezing fractions of an inch) I'd go with the highest velocity load. Thinking that wind is the worst enemy and time of flight would be the shortest.

Just my tho'ts.

I also plan on shooting F-class, so I'm being a little more anal than usual. That, and for me it's a way to gain a little more knowledge, being fairly new to shooting, and reloading, that's all.

I'd also try the 45.2 again. It's a nicely shaped triangular group that could possibly be turned into a "one hole" group with seating depth adjustments.

yeah, I'm thinking that I might load 6 each at 45.0, 45.2, and 45.5 and do one more group at 100, and then a group at 200 to see how they do. not expecting any real surprises, but you never know.

 

[royinidaho]

Oops! Sorry!! If I'd have read your initial thread regarding Valkyrie I would have known better. My bad

Seeing as nothin' is on TV and its dark outside and I can't afford any night vision stuff I did some personal analysis. Nothing scientific. More or less from experiences and IIN (Inverse Italian Notation )

Ok, we're going for the most consistent smallest group practicable. Good Deal.

When I have results as shown on your target I do the following:

The 45 gr group shows a strong horizontal component.

The 45.5 gr group show a strong vertical component.

I have found, usually, that success falls somewhere between those two powder charges.

This validated, in my book , by the 45.2 gr load which produced a very symmetrical group.

As we are usually limited by 0.10 grain increments, I'd load 3 each @ 45, 45.1, 45.2 and 45.3 and shoot them round robin again.

It may be revealing?

If more promise is shown with one of these loads I'd then start tweaking seating depth.

I'd recommend that you retain your practice of using fouler shots!

From your target it may well be that the 45.7 and 46.0 grain charges are headed for another higher velocity node??

Another thing that I've found is that when you get that "special" powder weight it may not produce the lowest ES and SD but will under varied temperatures an atmospheric conditions produce the smallest groups. More times that not I've found this to be the case. Chasing low ES/SD is a whole 'nother story.

Note that group sizes are for comparison only as they were measured using the same assumptions for all groups.

Good luck and good shooting.....

 

[emn83]

Oops! Sorry!! If I'd have read your initial thread regarding Valkyrie I would have known better. My bad

Seeing as nothin' is on TV and its dark outside and I can't afford any night vision stuff I did some personal analysis. Nothing scientific. More or less from experiences and IIN (Inverse Italian Notation )

Ok, we're going for the most consistent smallest group practicable. Good Deal.

When I have results as shown on your target I do the following:

The 45 gr group shows a strong horizontal component.

The 45.5 gr group show a strong vertical component.

I have found, usually, that success falls somewhere between those two powder charges.

This validated, in my book , by the 45.2 gr load which produced a very symmetrical group.

As we are usually limited by 0.10 grain increments, I'd load 3 each @ 45, 45.1, 45.2 and 45.3 and shoot them round robin again.

It may be revealing?

If more promise is shown with one of these loads I'd then start tweaking seating depth.

I'd recommend that you retain your practice of using fouler shots!

From your target it may well be that the 45.7 and 46.0 grain charges are headed for another higher velocity node??

Another thing that I've found is that when you get that "special" powder weight it may not produce the lowest ES and SD but will under varied temperatures an atmospheric conditions produce the smallest groups. More times that not I've found this to be the case. Chasing low ES/SD is a whole 'nother story.

Note that group sizes are for comparison only as they were measured using the same assumptions for all groups.

Good luck and good shooting.....

WOW, that's a lot of good info. Thanks! I was wary of trying .1gr increments because
am using a RCBS 5-0-5 scale, and didn't know if it was sensitive ehough for that. I might just give it a try though

I measured group sizes using a calipers, using the outside edge of the 2 shots furthest apart in each group, then subtracting .308 to get an estimate center to center group spread. Is that right? if so, I have decent group measurements for each increment. Thanks for doing that work! I'm having almost as much fun doing this figuring as shooting...almost

 

[royinidaho]

I might just give it a try though

Your 505 will work. Don't know if it is magnetic dampened or not. If not, when the bar swings as much above the mark as below the mark you're pretty much spot on.

I measured group sizes using a calipers, using the outside edge of the 2 shots furthest apart in each group, then subtracting .308 to get an estimate center to center group spread. Is that right?

[COLOR=""RoyalBlue""]Yep, that's correct.[/COLOR]

I'm having almost as much fun doing this figuring as shooting...almost

[COLOR=""RoyalBlue"]Yep it is almost as much fun as shooting. It does however, make the shooting even more rewarding.[/COLOR]

123

 

[emn83]

123

Thanks!

 

[Joe King]

The 45.0 group. 3 rounds in 2 holes. And those 2 holes are dispersed horizontally. Reload some at 45.0 and at 45.5 then go longer as SBruce says. See what ya get.

Just my thoughts.

+1.