Bullet Construction vs Lethality

[bultinkle]

I understand wanting to stay on topic but the sensitivity of anyone that doesn't agree on the same topic is a bit much.

I also don't really understand what we're supposed to talk about here at this point.

I think everyone wants the most trauma possible with adequate or more than penetration. That sliding scale unfortunately seems to have give and take in our current reality and people pick on the scale where they want to land… so where do we go from that?

We push to get as much of both as possible I guess? While also checking the bc box and easy to load for box where we can.

Again I would imagine we most likely all want as much as possible

 

[ButterBean]

I've quoted the OP and boldened the parts that apply to the following:


What are we supposed to be discussing here in this particular thread if we can't talk about things like cup and core vs mono and BC? It's a thread about bullet construction…. and obviously the BC a particular bullet has is a result of its design and construction. It's also a thread about how those things affect lethality.

A more accurate and predictable bullet that is less prone to shooter error and thus hits as close to where we were intending, the better. And if it does hit off the mark a bit, it hopefully is constructed in a way that makes it forgiving to that by producing wide wounding to still do what it takes to kill quick and clean- to be lethal.

The emphasis in this forum is long range hunting. So BC ought to matter and factor in. It at least shouldn't be made out as though it doesn't. If it doesn't to you, great, but it matters to others a whole lot. It matters in this particular discussion regardless.

I knew that was coming, just like clockwork

 

[JTH]

Yeah it maters, it matters how much you have to hold for the wind, if you run the numbers and look at them side by side on paper….. it's a small matter IMHO you gotta hold for the wind regardless.
No matter what bullet you use if you have enough time on the trigger with a chosen combination it shouldn't really matter, pick your poison and practice, and now we're right back to the same old conversation so let's get the cup and core vs mono's argument started

I'll have to respectfully disagree that it shouldn't matter.

I'm a big fan of copper solids and have used a lot of them. Looking at the load data from my 300 PRC, along with the Strelok wind drift data helps illustrate this. Both loads were about 1 grain below pressure running N570 powder.

One bullet that weighs 195 grains has a confirmed BC of .345, and max velocity in this rifle was 3045 fps. Plugging in a full value 10 mph wind and moving out to 800 yards gives me a drift of 30.5 inches.

Another bullet weighs 199 grains has a stated bc of .299 and max velocity in this rifle of 3040 fps. Plugging in a full value 10 mph wind and moving out to 800 yards gives me a drift of 36.5 inches,

I'm using a 10 mph wind because it's easy to run the math for more or less wind, but 10 mph is a fairly calm day in lots of places I've hunted.

Having 6 inches of additional drift is not an insignificant amount in my opinion. The smaller the game the more significant it becomes. Wind calls are rarely perfect from muzzle to point of impact, and the wind is frequently a little stronger than 10 mph where I hunt. Higher BC bullets give you a greater margin of error if your wind call was a little off.

Bottom line for me is that we need both, great terminal performance and high bc. Hopefully threads like this are added motivation for the manufacturers to continue improving their products. There's been tremendous improvement over the last several years but still room for more.

 

[Petey308]

I knew that was coming, just like clockwork

Why wouldn't it? You're saying things that don't make sense in this thread.

 

[BigBullBob]

Probably go with 338 caliber, Sierra bullets,338 Federal on the low end and 338-378 Weatherby Magnum on the upper end.Cover most of the bases, hunting wise.

Whats the go to sierra bullet?

 

[BigBullBob]

Probably go with 338 caliber, Sierra bullets,338 Federal on the low end and 338-378 Weatherby Magnum on the upper end.Cover most of the bases, hunting wise.

Whats the go to bullet from sierra?

 

[xsn10s]

I'm using a 10 mph wind because it's easy to run the math for more or less wind, but 10 mph is a fairly calm day in lots of places I've hunted.

Yup and the tricky thing is it could be calm where you are shooting from and a canyon will funnel wind down between you and your target. That is what gets most people, especially those with low bc bullets. We don't hunt in a lab or a bubble.

 

[Kingsgr8]

What I'm interested in finding out is why some manufacturers prefer mushrooms instead of shedding petals?

Why did you design your bullet to mushroom and not shed petals? Did you test both designs? And what were the outcomes, and what tests were conducted?

What I do not understand is why you would want a bunch of fragments in your meat. Wouldn't it be the same a getting a bite of a steel bb in a goose or duck?

 

[Huntnful]

I knew that was coming, just like clockwork

What? Him making an extremely valid statement?

It's very apparent you don't actually shoot, and definitely don't hunt long range. You would see in a big hurry that a bullet with a .240 BC will absolutely not put rounds on target with same the consistency of a .370 BC bullet at 1000 yards. It's not even close in fact. Groups also open up MUCH more with a low BC bullet at 1000 yards, compared the their original 100 yard group sizes.

 

[Petey308]

What? Him making an extremely valid statement?

It's very apparent you don't actually shoot, and definitely don't hunt long range. You would see in a big hurry that a bullet with a .240 BC will absolutely not put rounds on target with same the consistency of a .370 BC bullet at 1000 yards. It's not even close in fact. Groups also open up MUCH more with a low BC bullet at 1000 yards, compared the their original 100 yard group sizes.

 

[Huntnful]

What I do not understand is why you would want a bunch of fragments in your meat. Wouldn't it be the same a getting a bite of a steel bb in a goose or duck?

No it's not the same. Steel bb in a goose breast will about break your teeth. Soft lead, or even copper, fragments in game meat are hardly noticeable.

I honestly don't think I've gotten (or at least noticed) a single lead or copper fragment in any of my big game meat. And it's all I eat. But I don't shoot for the shoulders, try to just hit the lungs

 

[ButterBean]

What? Him making an extremely valid statement?

It's very apparent you don't actually shoot, and definitely don't hunt long range. You would see in a big hurry that a bullet with a .240 BC will absolutely not put rounds on target with same the consistency of a .370 BC bullet at 1000 yards. It's not even close in fact. Groups also open up MUCH more with a low BC bullet at 1000 yards, compared the their original 100 yard group sizes.

Wow you busted me, I don't even have a gun or hunt and I never said BC doesn't matter what I said was is you have to hold for the wind regardless, here's my question, if you all are so wrapped up in BC why would you shoot anything other than a 50 BMG with a 1.05 BC???? I'm mean what I'm getting from y'all every time this comes up y'all scream BC is king right ?

 

[Petey308]

No it's not the same. Steel bb in a goose breast will about break your teeth. Soft lead, or even copper, fragments in game meat are hardly noticeable.

I honestly don't think I've gotten (or at least noticed) a single lead or copper fragment in any of my big game meat. And it's all I eat. But I don't shoot for the shoulders, try to just hit the lungs

I've never bit into any fragments like that either. I carefully and thoroughly rinse any meat that the bullet went though anyway. And I use shoulder meat for sausage and jerky, so rinsing it doesn't harm the taste or quality.

To each their own though. If you don't like even the idea of lead in your meat, and want to use a mono to prevent it, I say more power to you. I hope threads like this help you pick a great one. I'm not sure this thread has seen a whole lot of productivity on that though, unfortunately. Some, but not a lot.

 

[3chester]

Whats the go to bullet from sierra?

#2610 is their 215gr not too shabby on the 338 Federal, up to the #2620 is their 225gr works well in 338Win Mags and #2600 is their 250gr Ultra Mag stopR.