Pressure signs on straight wall cases?

[Buck Buster]

Wildrose : When I fire form new cases my primers come back even with the base of the case, they are only loaded at 3/4 of a load. I seat my primers a hair deep just to make sure they are in far enough, never had a problem. I don't see a burr around the edge of the primer crater until I am at maximum manual load or higher. Again I only work past max if I don't see these signs of pressure, and stop and back off when I do. Always has worked for me without any problems. Good luck hunting and be safe.

 

[Buck Buster]

Lonewolf74 my 30-06 was at one time the most accurate 1000 yard gun at camp Perry, that don't make it a good 1000 yard hunting rifle. I shot a buck the last day one year with the 30-06 with 190 gr. sierra hollow point boat tail match king at 557 yards, my scope was a world class 4-16 power Tasco rangefinder scope. The scope said that the deer was 600 yards, I set it for that and shot off of a 3 step stool and parts of 2x4 s. I was shooting from one mountain to another, the buck was quartering towards me with its left side. Upon the first shot he ran down hill and behind some small pines, I thought I had missed him then he came out limping with his right side towards me broad side. About 2 seconds after my second shot he did a barrel roll, I knew he was down for keeps. Now the hard part finding him, I was alone so I just kept lining trees up as I went down one mountain and up the other. Fast forward I found him pretty easy , when he was processed it was determined the first shot hit right behind the left shoulder and lodged just under the hide on the right hind quarter. The second shot hit right behind the right shoulder and came out about 3 inchs from the fist shots entry. Bullet size hole on both sides. The first bullet that was lodged in the hind quarter never even opened up, completely intact, just rifling marks the length of the bullet. This Was actually too far for the 30-06 with this bullet. The 168 gr. Amax would probably would extend the 30-06 s distance for a hunting rifle. That being said it is best to use the right gun for the job , I know there are exceptions and temptations that make us try to extend the rifles true capabilities like I did, if that buck would not have come from behind the pines and let me know that he was hit he would have died and gone to waste. We owe it to the animals that we hunt to make ethical shots, that's why I use magnums now in areas that I may get that long shot or a close shot they work at both yardages. Good luck hunting and be safe.

 

[Buck Buster]

I'm in PA and live not far from the original 1000 bench rest club in Bodines. Some of those guys really load them hot. A lot depends on the type powder you use also, with some of the slower burning powders you wont be able to get enough powder in the case to cause excessive pressure. Most of the bench rest shooters I talk to use a compressed load, meaning they cant get anymore powder in the case. The compressed loads they say are best because no energy is lost filling the case with gases. All the energy is used to push the bullet down the tube. Some load so hot they get very few reloads per case, much hotter loads than I would ever use. Now some of these guns don't even look like a normal gun and they aren't , they are all steel. Big custom made actions and heavy barrels, some well over 2 inches in diameter and weigh 70 or more pounds. I don't know if you could ever get too much pressure to blow one of these things up! The casing would probably start out of the barrel before the gun blew up, they are that heavily built. I haven't been to the 1000 range for about 10 years or so, who knows what they have now. But for your average production rifle follow the reloading manual to be safe, and always start out well below maximum load and work up slowly like I said in my earlier Quotes. Good luck hunting and be safe.

 

[LoneTraveler]

Sorry I can find no loads for RL-10. All my books just list loads for RL-7.

 

[Pdvdh]

I measure case head expansion all the time with a 0.001" caliper, and find it completely sufficient. Measuring +/- 0.0002" is plenty good enough, and that can be done with a decent 0.001" caliper.
All the other signs of high pressure will be realized as case head expansion climbs past 0.0005" in my experiences. But 0.0005" isn't yet dangerous. It does confirm you're approaching the end of the road - pressure wise.

 

[Lonewolf74]

I measure case head expansion all the time with a 0.001" caliper, and find it completely sufficient. Measuring +/- 0.0002" is plenty good enough, and that can be done with a decent 0.001" caliper.
All the other signs of high pressure will be realized as case head expansion climbs past 0.0005" in my experiences. But 0.0005" isn't yet dangerous. It does confirm you're approaching the end of the road - pressure wise.

Ok how do you measure .0002 with a .000 caliper?
I like the idea of doing this best but have not because my caliper reads in half a thous, .0005, .0000 etc.

Can you measure this way every firing or is it most accurate on the first firing of a case?

 

[Lonewolf74]

Buck Buster I thank you for all the information and experience you have shared with me.
I just want to clarify that I am not trying to run my rifle real hot, just bring the cartridge up to it's full potential. The 45-70 has been around a long time so factory ammo and published load data is light for the sake of someone putting it in an old trap door or other weak action. The modern rifles especially the Marlin 1895 and Ruger #1 are built very strong and able to handle magnum class pressure.

 

[Lonewolf74]

Sorry I can find no loads for RL-10. All my books just list loads for RL-7.

I used Alliant's load data as a starting point and referenced several recipes that I found on Real Guns.com.

I started with RL7 then went to 10x and found I got a velocity gain with 10x at all charge weights I tested.

 

[Buck Buster]

74 : 10-4 Like I said you will be ok using the manual information and good common sense. I must admit that I do not get as high tec. as the other fellows do, I just do what my father did on the most part and go slowly and use common sense and refer to the loading manual. Have a wonderful day 74. Good luck hunting and be safe.

 

[Pdvdh]

Ok how do you measure .0002 with a .000 caliper?
I like the idea of doing this best but have not because my caliper reads in half a thous, .0005, .0000 etc.

Can you measure this way every firing or is it most accurate on the first firing of a case?

You must have a digital caliper. I use a dial caliper, so it's quite simple to identify +/- 0.0002" expansion. I wouldn't purchase a 0.0001" caliper or micrometer, or let that stop me from monitoring case head expansion. Monitoring for 0.0005" will still be helpful, as when you see that, you'll be confirming the other pressure signs you should already be experiencing.
In my experiences, you aren't in the more dangerous pressures where cases start to leak gas out the case head or primer until case heads expand well past 0.001". Maybe even more than 0.002". I don't have lots of experiences past 0.002", but the one's I've had it usually just meant the primer pockets expanded so much that the casing might need to be retired to the trash bin.
It's best to do this with the first firing of the cases. You can monitor expansion on later firings, of course, but the pressure/expansion relationship changes with additional firings, because the brass case head toughens up (work hardens) with each additional expansion/firing.