Gratuity/Tips for guided hunting

[redstone187]

I've reviewed some of the discussions regarding Gratuity/Tips for guided hunting trips on this forum. Most seem over a year old and are varied in conclusions. Just returned from a 4-day hunt in Wyoming for elk and questioned if I was tipping properly. Should it be based on the cost of the hunt? Is there a usual/expected amount per day regardless of price? If you tag-out early, should it be less (or perhaps more!)? What if there are multiple guides for the group (i.e one-on-one versus one guide for 2 or three hunters) - does each hunter tip (perhaps a smaller $) or does the group pool the total? How much to you tip the cook/wrangler (certainly, not as much as the guide)? Can this tip be pooled amount from all? If determined by % of the total cost of the hunt, is that % amount distributed to all the crew or to each of your guides? If that's the case, the cook might do best? Like others, I also detest this very American habit which is spiraling out of control. I'd be happy just to pay the outfitter more and have him pay his crew better.

If it is an owner/operator guide business that have already factored their profit into the fee. I usually tip the staff (assuming there is someone) privately and quit frankly tell the person not to even mention it. The cost of trips has become ridiculous. We own a lot of hunting ground and have never transitioned our ground AG to hunting only ground. Many farmers and ranchers have given up farming and ranching to only lease property to provide guided trip as there are people who are will to spend stupid money to hunt. It seems there is an expectation for a "tip" as their hand is out waiting for you put cash in it. Sort of like people paying $200 for a 1000 primers when they were $26/1000. If you continue to pay it, there will always be an expectation.

 

[Mtndog357]

I tip base on experience I have and effort of the guide. Wrangler and camp jack receive tips, but smaller than the guide. I once gave a great tip to a guide on a hunt I did not get an animal. But I didn't tag out because I chose to pass several "shooter" size elk. My choice to not harvest at animal shouldn't effect his tip when he works his butt off.

 

[epags]

No, it has gone too far, enough with the tipping.
If a Doctor literally saves your life, then maybe, otherwise no.

Da..m.....I forgot to tip him.....hope he isn't on call the next time.
edit: I did send a thank you note to the entire staff.

 

[Bob Milek]

Just a question to the Guides and Outfitters out there.
If someone books a four day hunt for say a Mule Deer and pays $10,000.00. Does not the Outfitter pay the Guide out of the $10k. Room/food/license out of the 10K and I understand that it is a business, but the Guide gets almost nothing from the Outfitter and depends on Tips? Suggesting that the guide should get additional $2K for the hunt? Plus the rest of the staff at the lodge get tips also?
We have gone on hunts where tipped individuals and also gone with other hunters and pooled the tips together for everyone.

Typically, the guide gets a very small percentage of the price of the hunt. In your example of $10,000.00, I would guess the guide may get paid $200.00/day. Doesn't sound bad, except if he does a really good job and tags you out early, he may only get $200.00- not all outfitters pay the guide per hunt, often they are paid only by the day. While most of the outfitters provide vehicles, fuel during the hunt, meals, and a bed, the guide still provides his own pack, knives, binoculars, rangefinders, etc. So to suggest that the pay a guide receives should be adequate to make a living is not necessarily accurate. There is a wide variance between outfitters and how things are handled.

 

[Pro2A]

Well, as I said, I guess honesty touches nerves. That's what I was trying to be, not offensive. I wasn't intending to get into the business aspect.
If you are a grown man and need a babysitter, their are people who also make a meager living in that field. Good day, and good luck in the woods.

Being a guide for many years, you know after the customers leave, guides commonly refer to the big-city customers as needing babysitting, or they'd die in the wilderness alone. You certainly didn't hit any of my nerves, but I clearly hit your nerves. And,.... ".....THEIR (hint...it's "there") are people who also make a meager living in that field." Seeing maybe more leading to $3/hr value....... If one makes a meager living in their chosen field, first blame that person staring back in one's morning mirror. Then, blame one's parents for not properly imprinting, preparing one for success in life.

 

[hydehunter]

you think it is tough trying to figure out what to tip for a hunt here then go to Africa and think about the tipping when there are as many as 15 people on staff with the outfitter and he expects you to tip all the camp staff, driver, tracker, skinners, and the PH it can easily get into thousands of dollars for a week

 

[Small Lady]

Being an Alaskan hunting guide I can tell you that I am always thankful for a tip from hunters.
Usually when I am asked about tips from hunters I say if you're happy with the service and treatment from your guide then 10% of the hunt cost is a good tip.
I have gotten that and also gotten no tip at all. It's part of the game.
There's a lot of interesting interactions that take place with people on hunts. Most good. Some bad.
For me it's 16 hour days mostly. Plus cooking. And packing the animals back to camp on my back.
I average 16$ hour on my hunts.
I don't get traveling money. I don't get money for hotels, food and taxis while I'm in civilization. Then there is the gear that has to be bought. Most years gear costs depends on factors that are not easily factored.
While all guides are in different situations if he/she gives you a good experience then a tip would be appreciated.
All the guides I know do it because they love it. Not for the money. But the money (tip) sure helps!!

Really like this post, thanks.

Appreciated, not expected.
That says it all.

My last restaurant meal experience was poor, and thus my tip left was 0.
I did pull out my pen, and write on a napkin "Your Service Sucks" and left it on the table. My boss was with me, and he laughed. The tip wouldn't have actually cost me anything, since the whole thing was paid for on a company credit card, but no way was she getting a tip, and she had to be made aware of why to in my opinion.

 

[gusd]

I do not understand why the fact keeps getting brought up that most guides are responsible for their own gear and tools . Almost every person that works in the trades or outside type of work has to pay for their own cloths and personal tools . Do we have to start tipping them now also??

 

[Small Lady]

I'm not sure if you're cheap or just ignorant but every guide deserves a tip regardless of outcome. They only have so many days to make money and most depend on those tips to survive. They are out there trying to fulfill dreams not hand you a cup of coffee. The time they invest into your success should be rewarded. If a client doesn't tip I ask them why? They are then black listed and I pay my guide 10% of the hunt cost out of my pocket. These guys are doing everything possible to make lasting memories, what's that worth to you?

If they are only working as a guide for such a limited time per year, then they have plenty of time for another job, like most people do.
Its unreasonable to think that they should make enough money in 30 to 50 days a year, to last them all year long.
Only retired people and kids should be working less than a minimum of 200 days per year. There are plenty of jobs available, so get 1, 2, or 3 other jobs.
Bartender, lawn care, snow plow operator, mechanic, nurse, delivery driver, parts person, auto detailer, dog walker, painter, cabinetmaker, upholstery person, electrician, and on and on goes the list.
It is absolutely insane to expect to work a month or two a year, and make a full years income.

 

[Bob Milek]

I know only one person who is a hunting guide.
This man has a full time job for the city, takes time off to guide part time.
He does it because he loves it, but has also told me that it pays much more per day than his regular city job.
He expects no tips, and feels bad when people try and tip him. So obviously not all guides are the same.

But lets do some quick math shall we.
Five day guided hunting trip for $5,000 is $1,000 per day.
Accommodations cost the outfitter say $100 per day, $100 to feed you, and lets call it $40 in gas to drive you around. But with 2 people per room, the owner is making a lot of profit on the room to.
So far the expenses are $240 a day, now the boss man takes $300 and shoves it into his pocket, still leaving $460. The government doesn't tax a business for what they spent, and so far its all tax free. Licenses, bookkeeping, insurance, and such, another $100 again all legit expenses, so not taxed. Now that guide makes $360, he does pay income tax on it, so pockets $250 a day per person, times however many hunters.
End of the year the owner pay some tax on the $300 he pocketed.
Now this owner has 8 to 16 people in hunting, say 4 groups of 2 each, so this all doubles, per group. That guide has 2 people paying him, not 1, but the owner is taking $300 times 8, so making $2400 to $4800 per day, plus a lot more on all those rooms..
Now that is a cheap hunt relatively.

Lets say this hunt is 5 days, but $10,000 per person.
Accommodations are a little nicer, so lets up it to $120 day, food is better to so $120 per day, owner takes $500 as his profits, and that $40 for gas, lets not forget the license, insurance, bookkeeping $100. So we are at $980 per day from $2000 per person. The left over $1,060 pays wages etc, but likely 2 people per guide, possibly 3 or 4, occasionally just 1.
How are these guides not doing really well?
Then they want a cash tip, which isn't even taxed on top of it all. Nice gig, I to want a job making $2000 to $5000 per day, a chunk of it not taxed, to go out and play in the woods, something I do for fun, and free.

The guide I know, flat out told me that he makes really good money guiding, while not the exact amount, said about as much per day guiding, as per week at his job, which is a good paying job for the city, as a heavy duty mechanic repairing city owned trucks, equipment, and such, for $39.15 an hour. Maybe some guides make crappy wages, but then why not quit, and open your own guiding company, or go work for someone who pays better.
By the way my boss owns a few hotels, and restaurants.
A typical hotel room doesn't cost anywhere near the $100 per person, based on double occupancy as laid out above, in fact it doesn't cost $100 total. Food cost in a restaurant is typically 27% of what you pay, so add in cooks, servers, sous chefs wages, overhead costs, insurance, snow clearing, bookkeeping, credit card machines, website costs etc it brings that up to 58% on an average diners bill, leaving 42% profit, that yes the owner pays tax on that 42%. So don't tell me that you can't feed these hunters really really well for $100/120 per day...the true cost is likely far less, but I way over budgeted the food and accommodations costs so nobody says that there is no way to do it for that amount.

By the way, recently stayed at a hotel owned by my boss, had the executive suite, really nice room, normal rate is $275 day, his cost including chambermaid, front desk staff, the free breakfast included, maintenance guy, heat, lights, phone, tv, etc is $81.09 per day. A cheaper, smaller room, goes for $149 per day, costs him $52.17.

First, don't base your opinions on the experiences of one person. Your figures may be ok for your area, but the expenses column is very shy for our area. It also does not include many big ticked items, such as hunting lease fees, that the outfitter incurs. Your friend may well earn more in a day guiding than he does in a week at his job- but the guiding lasts only a few weeks at most, and doesn't provide insurance and other benefits that his other job does. As for a guide who is not satisfied just opening his own business-- that is also an oversimplification. Most of the areas an outfitter is licensed for are on an exclusive basis- another outfitter can't just start his business and operate in the same area. Please be more familiar with the subject before you start telling guides how they should live. I don't know of one who would ask a client for a tip- but I have seen many clients who would expect more out of their guide than just finding them game at a reasonable range.

 

[Small Lady]

Thank you. I've been wanting to reply to some these people to go be poor some place else, lol

' Go be poor somewhere else ' What an arrogant attitude you have. It seems that you must be the poor person if you can't make enough money, so expect hand outs to survive. You are the type of person who is a major contributor as to why the world is going to hell. Tips should only be given for exceptional work done, not someone who is doing their job. If your job is guiding, then do it, cooks should cook, ranch hands work the ranch, mechanics fix stuff, and so on, but nobody should expect a tip for doing their job.
A truck driver was here earlier, I loaded up his truck for him. Even helped him strap it down, which is not my job to secure the load for truckers. We got to talking, and I asked him when the last time was that a customer tipped him. He looked at me confused, hesitating a bit answered "Never". I said so in 34 years as a truck driver, you have never received a tip. He again said that no he hadn't. So I mentioned this thread, and we talked about it. He, like myself said that it is ridiculous to expect a tip for doing our job. When almost done my boss pulls up on his ATV and chimed in on our conversation. My boss laughed, and also feels that it's crazy to expect a tip for doing something that is our job. Then my boss asked me if I brought it up because I was helping secure a load of hay, and it isn't my job. I told him no, that I just decided to help the driver because I was not rushing to anything else the second i had his load on, but that on a hunting forum I joined, was a thread about tipping guides. My boss is a wealthy man, and said if he should ever choose to hire a guide, that he would not be tipping anyone. He would pay the bill, and that concludes that business transaction. I then asked my boss how often he gets a tip, he had a good laugh.

 

[epags]

Well being a carpenter for 33 years I can say that I have received more tips from homeowners this year than ever before . Actually before this year I have never been given a tip . The homeowners tell me it's rude when I try to decline . Who am I to argue about a box or two of Busch Light !

While I was in the military and moving from one assignment to another (remember the military is paying for the move, I would be sure to give the movers a couple of dozen bottles of beer. Now days my spouse will tip her hair dresser each time and our window washers only Christmas.
I have tipped a brush pilot because he went of course for the tour to fly me over a remote radar site I had once been stationed at.
I have a host of jobs in my life and was never tipped (and never asked for a tip) although I think I alway did what I promised and with a smile.
edit: Opps....never say never. Once while helping out a widow with her miliary benefits she insisted in giving me a tip which I repeatedly declined...final we agreed that I would take the money and give it to the Navy Relief Fund as a donation in her name. And a Greek expat gave me the recipe to make my own Ouzo. You can PM me for it.

 

[Small Lady]

I do not understand why the fact keeps getting brought up that most guides are responsible for their own gear and tools . Almost every person that works in the trades or outside type of work has to pay for their own cloths and personal tools . Do we have to start tipping them now also??

Agreed!
I recently bought myself a $600 coat so I'll be warm and dry this winter. Considering my work, it will be junk by spring, and I'll throw it out, same as last winters coat. My boots, jeans, shirts, sunglasses, socks, and all wear out very quickly because I am working.
My customers don't tip me, not even a clothing allowance sort of tip, say 1%, much less 10%-20%. When I broke my $120 knife last month that I paid for, I bought a new knife with my own money, its called reality. While I was a nurse, bought my own scrubs, shoes, etc. The hospital didn't supply them, and never once was I offered a tip as a nurse.

How about the mechanic you use, who probably has spent $100,000 on tools and boxes, out of their own pocket, and doesn't expect a tip.
I dated an auto mechanic for 2 years, he had a small fortune invested in the tools he used for his work at the Kia dealership where he worked. It was rare for a customer to even thank him, and not once was he tipped.

 

[MJN030]

' Go be poor somewhere else ' What an arrogant attitude you have. It seems that you must be the poor person if you can't make enough money, so expect hand outs to survive. You are the type of person who is a major contributor as to why the world is going to hell. Tips should only be given for exceptional work done, not someone who is doing their job. If your job is guiding, then do it, cooks should cook, ranch hands work the ranch, mechanics fix stuff, and so on, but nobody should expect a tip for doing their job.
A truck driver was here earlier, I loaded up his truck for him. Even helped him strap it down, which is not my job to secure the load for truckers. We got to talking, and I asked him when the last time was that a customer tipped him. He looked at me confused, hesitating a bit answered "Never". I said so in 34 years as a truck driver, you have never received a tip. He again said that no he hadn't. So I mentioned this thread, and we talked about it. He, like myself said that it is ridiculous to expect a tip for doing our job. When almost done my boss pulls up on his ATV and chimed in on our conversation. My boss laughed, and also feels that it's crazy to expect a tip for doing something that is our job. Then my boss asked me if I brought it up because I was helping secure a load of hay, and it isn't my job. I told him no, that I just decided to help the driver because I was not rushing to anything else the second i had his load on, but that on a hunting forum I joined, was a thread about tipping guides. My boss is a wealthy man, and said if he should ever choose to hire a guide, that he would not be tipping anyone. He would pay the bill, and that concludes that business transaction. I then asked my boss how often he gets a tip, he had a good laugh.

I don't know …

I think a guide only works a certain amount of days per season . I also consider I guide service as part of hospitality . People who work in hospitality get tips .

Just my opinion . But the tips are based on service .