What's btw the 338 Edge and 338 Allen Magnum?

Discussion in 'Long Range Hunting & Shooting' started by fmajor, Feb 8, 2013.

  1. fmajor

    fmajor Well-Known Member

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    Hey gang -

    OK, i'm hoping in the next year or so (setting $ aside slowly), of ordering a long-range 338 caliber sledge hammer for elk sized game to 1,200 yds (the furthest i would ever dream of engaging game). I'll be going with a "custom" action/barrel, etc, but the chambering is my biggest question.

    I like being able to go a good bit (200-300fps) above 3,000fps in a 300gr bullet in .338 caliber without going to more extreme loadings like Kirby's 338 Allen magnum.

    What do folks think about the .338-.378 Wby? It seems to sit perfectly in between the 338 Edge/338 RUM/338 Allen Xpress/338 Lapua (all of which are amazing - i just want a little more performance) and the big, gigantic 338 monsters.

    I'm not a particular fan of all the hype related to the Weatherby brand, the radiused shoulders (though i don't have a factual basis for this) or the mega-spendy brass prices. However, the 338/378 seems like a perfect balance.

    What do you think?
     
  2. highridge1

    highridge1 Well-Known Member

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    Your looking at about 3000 fps with a 300 gr bullet in the 338-378 with a 28+ barrel.The brass is very expensive $60-$65 for 20 cases. 338 Edge you can have 50 pieces of brass for aprox $60 and get close to 2900 fps with similar barrel length. A elk isn't going to know the difference when they get hit with a 300 gr bullet from one or the other.
     

  3. fmajor

    fmajor Well-Known Member

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    Thanks and i appreciate your thoughts.

    I'm pretty sure a game animal isn't going to notice a 200fps gain, but that isn't a reason for setting this particular criteria.

    The 338 Edge/338 Lapua/338 Allen Xpress/338 Norma will *all* kill an elk with stunning affect at long ranges - of this there is no doubt.

    I just want to be able to consistently be over 3,000fps with a 300grn bullet in 338 caliber without having a barrel-burner or using a CheyTac parent case.

    Maybe i'm unrealistic and this is only achievable via a CheyTac parent case and/or 34" barrel. I dunno - that's why i'm asking the Expert Community here!
     
  4. Franklin

    Franklin Well-Known Member

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    Shawn Carlock is building rifles in a 338 edge +p that is shooting the 300grainers over 3100fps. Another choice would be the 338 excaliber.
     
  5. midwesthunter

    midwesthunter Well-Known Member

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    Shooting the 338 300 grain bullet at 2850 would give you this
    YOUR ROUND 300 GR. 0.818 B.C.
    Range Muzzle 300 600 900 1200
    Trajectory -1.5 -11 -67.6 -182 -368
    Come UP in MOA 0 3.5 10.8 19.3 29.3
    Come UP in Mils 0 1 3.1 5.6 8.5
    Wind Drift 0 2.8 11.8 27.9 52.2
    Wind Drift in MOA 0 0.9 1.9 3 4.2
    Wind Drift in Mils 0 0.3 0.5 0.9 1.2


    at 3000


    YOUR ROUND 300 GR. 0.818 B.C.
    Range Muzzle 300 600 900 1200
    Trajectory -1.5 -9.7 -60.1 -162.3 -328.1
    Come UP in MOA 0 3.1 9.6 17.2 26.1
    Come UP in Mils 0 0.9 2.8 5 7.6
    Wind Drift 0 2.6 11 25.8 48.4
    Wind Drift in MOA 0 0.8 1.7 2.7 3.9
    Wind Drift in Mils 0 0.2 0.5 0.8 1.1

    at 3100


    YOUR ROUND 300 GR. 0.818 B.C.
    Range Muzzle 300 600 900 1200
    Trajectory -1.5 -8.8 -55.7 -150.7 -304.9
    Come UP in MOA 0 2.8 8.9 16 24.3
    Come UP in Mils 0 0.8 2.6 4.7 7.1
    Wind Drift 0 2.5 10.5 24.7 46.1
    Wind Drift in MOA 0 0.8 1.7 2.6 3.7
    Wind Drift in Mils 0 0.2 0.5 0.8 1.1


    If your wanting 3000+ go with the edge in the +P If you are willing to settle for a little less and no necking up go with the 338 RUM in a 30" barrel. Any of your picks will get the job done for sure. I was getting right around 2900 out of my reg edge in a 30" lilja
     
  6. aroshtr

    aroshtr Well-Known Member

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    I doubt you will beat a 338 edge by 200fps with the 338-378 if they are both loaded to the same pressure. I have the 338 Allen Xpress, but if you are looking for 3100fps+ you will have to step up to the Excaliber case. If you want to stay with a standard weight action, I don't think you can beat one of the Lapua Improved versions. The brass quality and durability make it well worth the extra costs, IMHO. If you are dead set on the higher velocities, I would make the leap to a Cheytac case.

    Let us know what you end up building.

    Joel
     
  7. HuntFarther

    HuntFarther Well-Known Member

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    I think the requirements limit the cases for what he wants. I think the best option would probably be the snipetac. It would safely do what he want without pushing the limits. Next would be the edge +p but I cannot see why the regular edge would not work other than a velocity stipulation. Also the edge is pretty cheap to shoot, and is proven. I have only heard that the step throat the +p has will shoot out quicker. That is just what I heard.
     
  8. backwoods83

    backwoods83 Well-Known Member

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    The 338Lapua Imp, or Allen xpress which is an Imp version, has almost identical case capacity as the 338x378wby, the weatherby radious is very effective, however the case life of the Lapua brass when loaded to the max is much better, CIP test 338 lapua brass to 70k psi. With a 30" barrel either one is capable of 3200fps with the right throat design and Retumbo or Ramshot Magnum, but as I said the Lapua will have better case life and feed from a shorter magazine. At this point you are at your extreme limits and will have to move to a cheytac/Gibbs case.
     
  9. fmajor

    fmajor Well-Known Member

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    Thanks everyone for the replies.

    I wish Shawn Carlock gave more ballistic detail for his 338 Edge +P. I've searched quite a bit for it, but am not finding a lot of info. It seems many folks are more interested in the chamber blueprint with a complete dimension work-up (with possibly not the fairest of intentions.....).

    Otherwise, it seems the 338 Lapua AI derivative chamberings are about the only other way to get at 3,100-3,200fps with a 300grn pill.

    As an aside, i'd generally want to stay at about 30" finished bbl length so this would put a significant strain on my goal. Maybe the 338 AM is the only way to achieve what i was initially thinking....

    Again, thank you all so much for the dialogue.
     
  10. snowpro440

    snowpro440 Well-Known Member

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    fmajor .To put it plainly "There's no free lunch here ". For what you want to achieve it either cost money to do it with a short barrel life with or be conservative on the distance/velocity with a little longer barrel life .
     
  11. Kiwi Greg

    Kiwi Greg Well-Known Member

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  12. fmajor

    fmajor Well-Known Member

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    Holy SMOKES!!! That's exactly what i was looking for - thank you!!! I didn't see this anywhere and wowser that's a big 'ol boomer for sure.

    Yup, once again 'ol Kirby brings the heat - and the stove and the ____. gun)