What gun for grizzly? what do guides use ?

Discussion in 'General Discussion' started by 6BR4ME2, Oct 4, 2006.

  1. 6BR4ME2

    6BR4ME2 Well-Known Member

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    Just talked with a man that just went on a moose hunt in British Columbia with his 2 sons. Trip of a lifetime, however after one moose was down a grizzly had been coming back to the gut pile, so the guide told them to be very careful.

    Now I asked him what gun did you have? he told me and I will say I would have liked something a lot bigger than his. What gun did the guide have? He "wasn't sure what it was called" but "it was big"..so I was just curious as to what guides in Alaska and BC use for thier well being on these types of hunts? /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/shocked.gif
     
  2. Festus

    Festus Well-Known Member

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    6BR...,

    .338 wm & .375 H&H are very popular with guides up here. It's difficult to be overgunned for griz, it's not so difficult for the hunter to be overgunned. You should carry the biggest caliber you can shoot well and have confidence in. Heavier premium bullets are better for deeper penetration. Some guides prefer a barrel of about 20" for close in work and in the alder thickets. The .30-06 with 200 gr. Nosler PTN's will get the job done but I prefer to think of the .338 wm as a practical minimum. The .338-06 or .35 Whelen would be fine.

    Good Hunting, Festus
     

  3. lovdasnow

    lovdasnow Well-Known Member

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    don't a lot of guides up there us a 12ga with slugs for their back-up gun?? big, heavy lump of lead would hit a charging bear pretty hard!

    curious also to what they use....
     
  4. Guest

    Guest Guest

    On of my gun Mags had a year long 100 year anniversary <font color="red"> LOVE FEST </font> of the 30-06. In one issue they detail a Griz hunt with a '06. After seeing a huge black bear charge my Dad after a well placed 200gr from his '06 - I consider the '06 too small for large blackies. Way too small for griz.
     
  5. James Jones

    James Jones Well-Known Member

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    I know a fella that guided up in BC for a while and he liked a 458Win mag and said that alot of guys used them , the recoil isin't overly abusive , the power is realy good and they preform well with a short 22" barrel. I would think that anything from 375 H&amp;H would be a decient charge stoper for griz.
    I have to say though , I sure love my REm 870 thats setup as a patrole shotgun , I can rack off 8 WELL PLACED shots of 3" mag 000 buck shot faster than 99% of guys can shoot 2 from a bolt gun thats 60+ 33 cal lead balls , I'm thinking that a griz is only gonna take so much of that before decides he doesen't want anymore.
     
  6. Mountainsheep

    Mountainsheep Well-Known Member

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    6BR..,
    There seems to be two different schools of thought on the back-up guns used by bear guides. 1st is the short carbine in a heavy cal. such as 45/70, .450 Marlin, ect. or iron-sighted bolt actions from .338 Win - .458 Win for close encounters in thick cover or stopping an attack. The latest trend seems to be that the bear guides are starting to become more like the African PH, in that they are using a scoped rifle to make an immediate follow-up shot to avoid tracking a wounded bear. The .338 and the .375 are most common but the .416 is gaining in popularity.
    Dave
     
  7. Shawn Carlock

    Shawn Carlock Sponsor

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    My brother in law guides in AK for sheep and bears. In the open country he carries a 338 Win mag, in brush country he favors a lever rifle (8 shot) in 50 Alaskan. After a couple of less than fun experiences he was making noise about a 416 Rem.
     
  8. jwp475

    jwp475 Well-Known Member

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    When I lived in Alaska I shot 2 Grizz one with a 338 Win. Mag and one with a 475 Linebaugh revolver, both worked very well. The one with the 475 came in on us while cleaning a Moose, Jimmy shot first with a 338 and the bear went down and was up instantly, and quartering away,My shot hit behind the last rib in line with the opposite shoulder. At the shot the bear went striaght down with all 4 legs striaght out and that was that. I knew a guide out of the Fairbanks area and he used rifles from the 30-06 up to and including a 458 Win. Mag., and he said they all worked well if shot placement is adequate. Phil Shoemaker has stated in print that an 06 with good 200 to 220grain bullet is adequate for any and all bears.The 338 Win as well as the 375 H&amp;H was very popular when I was living in Alaska.
     
  9. Roll-Yur-Own

    Roll-Yur-Own Well-Known Member

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    I believe the question refers to a gun for protection not for a grizz hunt.

    For protection, either a handgun or shotgun.
     
  10. jwp475

    jwp475 Well-Known Member

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    [ QUOTE ]
    I believe the question refers to a gun for protection not for a grizz hunt.

    For protection, either a handgun or shotgun.

    [/ QUOTE ]

    A handgun only for those that can use the big bores to thier potential.. When I lived in Alaska the Fish and Game had recomendations for Bear protection derived from testing and the shotgun with either slugs or buckshot was rather low on the list.
    The same question was asked here:
    http://forums.accuratereloading.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/4711043/m/400104845

    Posted by Phil Shoemaker:

    458Win
    one of us

    Posted Oct 5, 10:06 AM Hide Post
    THERE IS NO SUCH THING AS ONE BEST BROWN BEAR CALIBER. A good bear hunter can make do with most any reasonable caliber. For most of the past seventy years the rifle of choice for the vast majority of Alaskan guides was the 30-06 and it still works as well today -actually even better with modern bullets - than ever. I have used one to kill half a dozen big bears - including serious up-close full-on charges.
    That said, I don't consider it the ultimate big bear caliber but it works.
    I don't have the exact number of bears my clients have killed over the past 25 years but it is somewhere between 100 and 150. In my experience the "ideal" calibers begin with the 338 Win, include the 358 Win, 35 Whelen, 9.3x62, 375H&amp;H and up to the modern 45-70 loads.
    The various 416's and 458's are great as a stopper for guides who might be required to stop a charging, wounded bruin but are absolutely un-necessary for any qualified hunter after un-wounded bears. If you honestly can handle one well they are fine but 99%+ of every hunter I've seen carrying the biggest bores are unreasonably afraid of both their rifles and of bears , which is a deadly combination. That is why if you ask the vast majority of experienced big bear guides what caliber they recommend they will recommend something close to what I have. A gut shot bear with a 460 WBY is a lot more dangerous than one heart shot with a 30-06.


    Phil Shoemaker
     
  11. J E Custom

    J E Custom Well-Known Member

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    6BR

    A lot of good comments so I will add mine.

    I would consider a 338 to be minimun, no doubt a
    well placed shot from any 270,3006 etc will kill
    a brown/griz but how far will he run before dying.

    This could be a problem if in heavy cover.

    So I believe a big bore would be best for one
    shot kills and stoping power.

    A 416 with a 350 gr bullet is awesome.

    Better to have him for lunch than vice/versa.

    In answer to your other question, most guides
    like and recomend 375s,458s and 416s.

    J E CUSTOM
     
  12. jwp475

    jwp475 Well-Known Member

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  13. 6BR4ME2

    6BR4ME2 Well-Known Member

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    Lot of good responses thanks !!!!
    was just wondering what those guys used....
     
  14. J E Custom

    J E Custom Well-Known Member

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    All most everone who posted including yourself agreed
    that a big bore of some type was recommend.

    A guide/PHs main responsibility hunting dangerous game is
    the safety of his hunter.

    I love to bow and pistol hunt but I would not book with an outfitter that carried a 3006 as a backup.

    So If I were hunting brown or grizzly by my self i would
    have a big bore.

    I have never heard of a PH in africa carring a 30cal as a backup when hunting dangerous game with a client.

    So my recommendation to 6BR still stands.

    No reason to send a man to a gun fight armed only
    with a knife.

    I prefer one shot kills that drop where they are shot.

    Different strokes for different folks /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif /ubbthreads/images/graemlins/smile.gif

    J E CUSTOM