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Rifles, Reloading, Optics, Equipment
Rifles, Bullets, Barrels & Ballistics
"Custom" rifles
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<blockquote data-quote="vancewalker007" data-source="post: 2710732" data-attributes="member: 66917"><p>>Most people think a custom rifle is buying an action from X manufacturer, a barrel from Y brand and a </p><p>>stock from Z brand. Then misc parts from others while having a random gunsmith screw it all together. >Voila, "check out my custom rifle!"</p><p></p><p>A good GS does a lot more than screw parts together. But yes, in general if you pick the trigger (weight setting/type), unchambered barrel, cartridge, action, scope scope mounts, stock/metal finishes, chamber layout, magazine type/size, stock type and fit finish (assuming its being made per your specs and not a canned stock), muzzle finish ie. crowned, threaded for brake or suppressor mount etc. I'd say that a full custom. Full in the sense that every aspect you can choose with parameters you applied your own.</p><p></p><p></p><p></p><p>>Is it still a custom rifle if you do all of the above but buy a chambered/headspace barrel from </p><p>>manufacturer Y and spin it together yourself?</p><p></p><p>I would call it semi custom because you had no control over the chamber cut, but that is splitlting hairs some.</p><p></p><p></p><p>>Companies like Bergara, Fierce, Christensen etc make their own actions, barrels, stocks etc in house but </p><p>>most don't call those custom rifles.</p><p></p><p>I would call the small volume specialized canned products like Proof, Fierce, Seekins, Cooper et el "High End Low Volume boutique Rifles. I believe most of these companies have custom shops that allow the creation of full custome rifles. I would not put Bergara or Christensen in this group as far as their canned rifles. I see these rifles like wines from small volume wineries. Makers like Gunwerks come much closer to true custom rifles because they allow several parameters to be selected but I don't think they will tweak a chamber out of SAAMI spec for you.</p><p></p><p></p><p>>What is actually "custom" about a custom rifle? Maybe every once in a while one will have a slightly </p><p>>different chamber compared to a SAAMI spec reamer.</p><p></p><p></p><p>All the various parameters and parts choices as discussed above; actions, triggers, stocks, barrels, chambers and all the params surrounding each of them. It can be fairly large combination of params.</p><p></p><p></p><p>>How does a mass produced Bergara action differ from a mass produced Defiance action?</p><p></p><p>First, the term "Mass Procduced" cannot equally be applied to the two companies. Bergara is likely churning out 2-3 times as many or maybe more actions a year than Defiance. They both will typically do their job as expected. The Defiance action is going to be made to tighter tolerances, better parts and likely as smooth or smoother. I have read about many issues with the Bergara centered around the firing pin mechanisms and the firing pin holes where the action would not go bang and required the firing pin to be fixed with a bushing to make it work. Also, I have read about extractor issues with the Bergara bolts. I have never read about any such issues with Defiance actions, but with the new ownership that may change haha.</p><p></p><p></p><p>>If you take a Christensen Ridgeline and drop it into a McMillan is it now a "custom" rifle?</p><p></p><p>I would call that semi custom. You took a canned barreled action/trigger and dropped it into a stock you chose with stock features you specified.</p><p></p><p></p><p>I think the biggest question is will an off the shelf rifle be accurate enough for a person's needs in the field or at the competition bench. This answer likely has even more variables than those custom rifle choices. I've seen a number of very accurate off the shelf rifles. They exist but in the past this was basically a roulette wheel spin chance of getting a good one. I would say the boutique makers have narrowed the distance in this area some plus some mass production makers seem to be doing pretty good. I've heard very good things about Weatherby and Browning lately. One of the biggest issues I run into with off the shelf rifles is the stock fit and handling in shooting positions. That translates to shootability and ultimately accuracy.</p><p></p><p></p><p><strong>My favorite full custom has the following custom choices:</strong></p><p></p><p>Proof Sendero Carbon Wrapped 26in 1:8 barrel</p><p></p><p>McMillan Game Hunter Carbon fiber stock, in a molded in color I picked, edge fill, cut to my specific length of pull, inletted for the action I selected, with the inlet drilled for pillars but no pillars installed, picatinny rail for bipod/tripod, and push button sling swivels</p><p></p><p>Defiance Deviant UltrLight XM length Action</p><p></p><p>Defiance XM length BDL hinged floor plate</p><p></p><p>Timney Calvin Elite 2-stage trigger with no bolt release set to 8 ounces and 16 ounces</p><p></p><p>Metal finish color I selected</p><p></p><p>Muzzle threaded for a brake or suppressor</p><p></p><p>Seekins lower 34mm rings</p><p></p><p>Chamber finished with a longer than SAAMI throat leade to fit a specific bullet such that the bullet base stays out of the powder column when in the lands</p><p></p><p>The fitment of the action, magazine and stock were aided by leaving out the pillars in the stock by McMillan so the GS could custom build pillars to tightly fit the action, magazine and stock together. This seems to make the action run rounds very smoothly as 22 big game animals being shot with no rifle cycling issues as well as hundreds of rounds being shot in load development and range prep can attest to.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="vancewalker007, post: 2710732, member: 66917"] >Most people think a custom rifle is buying an action from X manufacturer, a barrel from Y brand and a >stock from Z brand. Then misc parts from others while having a random gunsmith screw it all together. >Voila, "check out my custom rifle!" A good GS does a lot more than screw parts together. But yes, in general if you pick the trigger (weight setting/type), unchambered barrel, cartridge, action, scope scope mounts, stock/metal finishes, chamber layout, magazine type/size, stock type and fit finish (assuming its being made per your specs and not a canned stock), muzzle finish ie. crowned, threaded for brake or suppressor mount etc. I'd say that a full custom. Full in the sense that every aspect you can choose with parameters you applied your own. >Is it still a custom rifle if you do all of the above but buy a chambered/headspace barrel from >manufacturer Y and spin it together yourself? I would call it semi custom because you had no control over the chamber cut, but that is splitlting hairs some. >Companies like Bergara, Fierce, Christensen etc make their own actions, barrels, stocks etc in house but >most don't call those custom rifles. I would call the small volume specialized canned products like Proof, Fierce, Seekins, Cooper et el "High End Low Volume boutique Rifles. I believe most of these companies have custom shops that allow the creation of full custome rifles. I would not put Bergara or Christensen in this group as far as their canned rifles. I see these rifles like wines from small volume wineries. Makers like Gunwerks come much closer to true custom rifles because they allow several parameters to be selected but I don't think they will tweak a chamber out of SAAMI spec for you. >What is actually "custom" about a custom rifle? Maybe every once in a while one will have a slightly >different chamber compared to a SAAMI spec reamer. All the various parameters and parts choices as discussed above; actions, triggers, stocks, barrels, chambers and all the params surrounding each of them. It can be fairly large combination of params. >How does a mass produced Bergara action differ from a mass produced Defiance action? First, the term "Mass Procduced" cannot equally be applied to the two companies. Bergara is likely churning out 2-3 times as many or maybe more actions a year than Defiance. They both will typically do their job as expected. The Defiance action is going to be made to tighter tolerances, better parts and likely as smooth or smoother. I have read about many issues with the Bergara centered around the firing pin mechanisms and the firing pin holes where the action would not go bang and required the firing pin to be fixed with a bushing to make it work. Also, I have read about extractor issues with the Bergara bolts. I have never read about any such issues with Defiance actions, but with the new ownership that may change haha. >If you take a Christensen Ridgeline and drop it into a McMillan is it now a "custom" rifle? I would call that semi custom. You took a canned barreled action/trigger and dropped it into a stock you chose with stock features you specified. I think the biggest question is will an off the shelf rifle be accurate enough for a person's needs in the field or at the competition bench. This answer likely has even more variables than those custom rifle choices. I've seen a number of very accurate off the shelf rifles. They exist but in the past this was basically a roulette wheel spin chance of getting a good one. I would say the boutique makers have narrowed the distance in this area some plus some mass production makers seem to be doing pretty good. I've heard very good things about Weatherby and Browning lately. One of the biggest issues I run into with off the shelf rifles is the stock fit and handling in shooting positions. That translates to shootability and ultimately accuracy. [B]My favorite full custom has the following custom choices:[/B] Proof Sendero Carbon Wrapped 26in 1:8 barrel McMillan Game Hunter Carbon fiber stock, in a molded in color I picked, edge fill, cut to my specific length of pull, inletted for the action I selected, with the inlet drilled for pillars but no pillars installed, picatinny rail for bipod/tripod, and push button sling swivels Defiance Deviant UltrLight XM length Action Defiance XM length BDL hinged floor plate Timney Calvin Elite 2-stage trigger with no bolt release set to 8 ounces and 16 ounces Metal finish color I selected Muzzle threaded for a brake or suppressor Seekins lower 34mm rings Chamber finished with a longer than SAAMI throat leade to fit a specific bullet such that the bullet base stays out of the powder column when in the lands The fitment of the action, magazine and stock were aided by leaving out the pillars in the stock by McMillan so the GS could custom build pillars to tightly fit the action, magazine and stock together. This seems to make the action run rounds very smoothly as 22 big game animals being shot with no rifle cycling issues as well as hundreds of rounds being shot in load development and range prep can attest to. [/QUOTE]
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