Shane Lindsey
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- Jul 13, 2010
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- 3,346
You also live as a desert yeti
East coast, you let it sit for a month and I get orange dust coming out of the bore.
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East coast, you let it sit for a month and I get orange dust coming out of the bore.
lancetkenyon
Well-Known Member
Yeah, there is that...You also live as a desert yeti
East coast, you let it sit for a month and I get orange dust coming out of the bore.
lancetkenyon
Well-Known Member
In my defense:
I shoot from 10° to 115°+. Year round. About 48 weeks a year. Average 5600 rounds a year.
I shoot from 1100'AMSL to 9500'AMSL.
I travel from 30 minutes to 12+ hours to hunt.
I can have a rifle in a truck on a hunt for 10 straight days in a soft case and still make 1st round hits.
I take rifles last shot at 95° and 1100' and sit in a safe for a couple months, then go hunt in 20° weather at 9000' and make first round hits.
I have made 1st round hits on game out to 1367 yds and steel out past 1500 yds.
The things I NEVER do...
Clean a rifle before a hunt. Even if I have time to foul it unless I can run 20+ rounds down it.
Hunt on a clean bore.
Take a rifle that I haven't shot in a few years without verification.
Buy cheap optics/rifles.
Change ammo.
Great comments, appreciated. I have a CA 300PRC purchased for long distance hunting. Posted it in LRH section thinking the quality of replies would help me big picture achieve the long distance hunting accuracy expected on the first shot. TU
Muddyboots
Well-Known Member
Bottom line is some barrels might need 20+ rounds to foul to consistency. Which like most said, leave it alone once it settles down with accuracy. Just have fun and shoot it then.
Grizzly60
Well-Known Member
After cleaning my barrels, I push a patch with dry graphite down the barrel. Cold bore shots are in the group.
Laelkhunter
Well-Known Member
He's new. I guess he saw "LRH Group" and figured he was trying to shoot a group, but the first was a flyer so this is the place to post his question..
Laelkhunter
Well-Known Member
I do the same. I use colloidal graphite that I get from Greg Tannel at Gretan rifles. The graphite is much finer and seeps into the crevices that need filling in the throat of the barrel.
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If your total sample size is 6 rounds from two different bullets (3 rounds each), your sample size is too small to determine if you have first round flyers or how far those flyers are outside the non-flyers. Add to that, if the barrel only has 6 rounds through it, the barrel hasn't seen enough rounds to be considered settled or predictable in what to expect.
Everyone has different opinions, and while I start my opinions of a rifle/barrel from the very first shot, I put 40-80 rounds through a barrel before I start to consider a final opinion of its potential and it's traits
Everyone has different opinions, and while I start my opinions of a rifle/barrel from the very first shot, I put 40-80 rounds through a barrel before I start to consider a final opinion of its potential and it's traits
Provided the rifle, scope & mounts are sound, I have found that the "cold bore shot" is really a "cold shooter shot". I have proved this with/to dozens of long range precision students when I was teaching.
The "clean bore shot" really IS a thing and can usually be brought into the main group by degreasing and drying the bore with 90+% alcohol before shooting. By removing traces of solvent and oil, we can usually get the first bullet to land with the rest of them. That WILL allow your chrome-moly barrel to rust, but doesn't seem to have any effect on a good quality stainless barrel, my own preference for long range rifles.
Regarding the cold shooter shot, most often there is insufficient shoulder pressure due to a loose grip on the rifle. Heavy/fluffy winter clothing exacerbates this issue and must be compressed during the shot.
The shooter fires the first shot and notices the rifle jumps a little more than expected, and oddly enough, that first bullet is out of the group. They tighten up a little for following shots and their group stabilizes. Everyone wants to blame something else, so of course it's gotta be a "cold bore", LOL.
Numerous times I have had students fire a couple shots with one of my rifles, then immediately move over to their own cold rifle and they do NOT experience the cold "bore" (shooter) shot. Go figure.
Those who refused to acknowledge this continue to be plagued by a lost first shot.
The way I had people who shoot one shot at a time for a living handle this is to exaggerate their shoulder pressure for the first shot, which better normalizes it and keeps it in the main group. What seems exaggerated for the first shot is actually where one ends up after realizing their first shot was a little loose.
I teach shoulder pressure regulation by using the firing hand fingers to pull the stock against the should approximating the pressure sensation of a firm handshake grip. This amount of pressure is easy to quantify since most of us shake hands enough to know what a *firm* handshake is, and it is enough pressure to keep the bullet in the group.
The "clean bore shot" really IS a thing and can usually be brought into the main group by degreasing and drying the bore with 90+% alcohol before shooting. By removing traces of solvent and oil, we can usually get the first bullet to land with the rest of them. That WILL allow your chrome-moly barrel to rust, but doesn't seem to have any effect on a good quality stainless barrel, my own preference for long range rifles.
Regarding the cold shooter shot, most often there is insufficient shoulder pressure due to a loose grip on the rifle. Heavy/fluffy winter clothing exacerbates this issue and must be compressed during the shot.
The shooter fires the first shot and notices the rifle jumps a little more than expected, and oddly enough, that first bullet is out of the group. They tighten up a little for following shots and their group stabilizes. Everyone wants to blame something else, so of course it's gotta be a "cold bore", LOL.
Numerous times I have had students fire a couple shots with one of my rifles, then immediately move over to their own cold rifle and they do NOT experience the cold "bore" (shooter) shot. Go figure.
Those who refused to acknowledge this continue to be plagued by a lost first shot.
The way I had people who shoot one shot at a time for a living handle this is to exaggerate their shoulder pressure for the first shot, which better normalizes it and keeps it in the main group. What seems exaggerated for the first shot is actually where one ends up after realizing their first shot was a little loose.
I teach shoulder pressure regulation by using the firing hand fingers to pull the stock against the should approximating the pressure sensation of a firm handshake grip. This amount of pressure is easy to quantify since most of us shake hands enough to know what a *firm* handshake is, and it is enough pressure to keep the bullet in the group.
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Idaho Lefty
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IF, I had to Shoot 20 Round's thru My Tikka Hunting Rifles to FOUL and get GOOD, POI "Cold Bore", shots,.. I'd,.. Wrap them, around a Tree !
Clean,.. then, 2 TWO, Three Max, Fouling shots, "Get it Done" in My, carefully, "Broke in",.. Tikka, Rifles.
I ALWAYS Hunt with, a Fouled, Dirty Barrel !
Then, I Clean them, at around, 80 to 100, Fired shots.
I'm Finding that, My FIRST shot after, a Cleaning is usually about,. 3/8 th's to, a 1/2 inch, away from, the Next, 5 shots.
Maybe I'm just Lucky, But I HAVE, 3 Tikka's and all of them, are, doing,.. THIS !
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The rife that BRG3883 is referencing is:
Rifle: Christensen Arms Traverse
Caliber: 300 PRC
Weight: ~10lbs loaded
Scope: Leupold MK5 5-25x56
Reticle: H59
Trigger: Trigger Tech
Muzzle Brake: Area 419 Sidewinder
Ammo: Hornady ELD-X 212gr (recommended by Christensen Arms)
*Multiple different ammo brands/grains have been tried with similar results: Hornady ELD-M 225gr, Hornady Outfitter 190gr, Berger Elite Hunter 205gr, Berger Hybrid Target 215gr, Berger Elite Hunter 245gr, and Barnes LRX 208gr.
**BRG3883 also had Copper Creek Cartridge Co. hand load Hornady ELD-X 212gr, Berger EH 205gr, Berger HT 215gr, and Berger EH 245gr.
The rifle was returned to Christensen Arms in February and they replaced the barrel. Attached is the "Test Report" from Christensen Arms. The test report shows a sub-MOA group with Hornady ELD-X 212gr.
Attachments
I'll second this. Saw a video about a year ago and have been testing it since and for whatever reason, it has made a significant improvement in cold bore shots after cleaning.
