What's the highest magnification you use while hunting from 500 to 1,000 yards?
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Rich Coyle
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What are you disagreeing with?
Rich Coyle
Well-Known Member
Everyone who has come to my porch and compared scopes and binoculars looking at the deer antlers 131 yards away has observed the very same thing. Turn up the magnification and your optic lasts longer. When a friend of mine brought two of his Swarovskis to compare with my Bushnell 6500 he also discovered the same thing. He was a little late so the sun was already behind the western hills. The way I determine if I can continue with a particular optic is can I see the first long tine on the left enough to shoot the deer carrying them. Consequently we had to raise the magnification on his z6 5-30X50 until he could see the antlers clearly. It required 15X at 7:05PM.
Then I adjusted the other two to the same magnification setting of 15X. The z6 lasted until 7:13PM. The Bushnell went down at 7:24PM. That is eleven minutes longer for something costing about 1/3. When it came to the other Swarovski it was like a college player against a professional. The z8i was that much better. Bright and clear. Light right to the edge with almost no ring. The fantastic Swarovski z81 lasted until 7:44PM! Twenty minutes longer than a very good scope. We both agreed on the time for all three scopes.
I have pages of info like this with different guys participating. If you want me to post about some of the binoculars I will. Beyond a shadow of a doubt those who have used the optic chart and the deer antlers have discovered exit pupil might be a sales tool, but it can't be used in real life as criteria that one is better than another.
gohring3006
Well-Known Member
Well Rich, I have been shooting rifles and scopes for years. And I'll tell you, my observation is totally opposite of yours. So I really don't know why you would insist, your observation is the law, no one else is right but you... well you're wrong.
Rich Coyle
Well-Known Member
Maybe you missed the "Everyone" above. Most folks have not taken the time to actually know their stuff. I used to think my Bushnell was as good as my Nightforce when I used leaves and twigs 150 yards away. Now I know better.
Have you actually set up deer antler or an optic chart and compared one of your scopes on it as darkness sets in?
gohring3006
Well-Known Member
No, I'm really just going off of "observation" of different people.
For instance, one guy loves the vortex gen 2 pst. Says it's by far better than any scope on its price range. The next guy comes along and says, the XTR2 blows it away. Then another days the SHV is more clear than both. The other two guys argue he's wrong. You see???
Just because you and your buddies are standing on the porch looking thru optics, and saying the higher mag is better. The next group of guys, dial them back and say you're wrong.
Exit pupil is a science and mirage is taken into account with most serious shooters. And higher mag scopes are bad for both, even in high end optics.
It's all subjective to the individual...
Lower mag scopes always appears brighter at dusk for me.
Rich Coyle
Well-Known Member
In other words you have not done something yourself. The idea of appearing brighter is irrelevant to this conversation. The idea I'm suggesting is not what appears brighter but what allows you to see earlier and later.
All the antidotal info you posted about ignorant scope users proves nothing except some like one better than another.
aldeerhunter
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At dusk there is a trade off between magnification and clarity/light being transmitted.
Are you saying that even when dialed back to 5, my 5-25 or 5-50 scope is not as clear as a 4-14 powered scope. If you are, that is not my experience.
For sure, at dusk/almost dark, when I dial up to 50, the dark ring appears, but I can dial back to a point and get a clear picture, and its not anywhere near the lowest setting.
Are you saying that even when dialed back to 5, my 5-25 or 5-50 scope is not as clear as a 4-14 powered scope. If you are, that is not my experience.
For sure, at dusk/almost dark, when I dial up to 50, the dark ring appears, but I can dial back to a point and get a clear picture, and its not anywhere near the lowest setting.
gohring3006
Well-Known Member
I used that response to tell you, not everyone agrees with you. That doesn't mean they're wrong. You are getting combative over subjective opinions. Why?
And yes, I tested many scopes. And your opinion doesn't line up with mine.
gohring3006
Well-Known Member
If you opinion is the rule, why isn't all hunting scopes 36 power? Or even 50 power?
Why are most hunting scopes ranging from 1.5 power to 24 power, with most guys choosing somewhere around 18 powrer as max.
I think I know,
Eye box
Better light gathering/exit pupil size,
Eye relief is usually more.
Mirage is less
Field of view.
All of those make a good hunting scope.
All of those make you "see" better.
Sorry, no post. Hit the wring button
Barrelnut
Well-Known Member
I believe we are hijacking the OP's thread. I will jump back in one more time though...
Because this side discussion should shed "light" on the OP's decision to use a Golden Eagle 15-60x52 scope for hunting, as the scope would be far from ideal in low light situations....
Aldeerhunter, ("Are you saying that even when dialed back to 5, my 5-25 or 5-50 scope is not as clear as a 4-14 powered scope. If you are, that is not my experience. ") cannot be answered because you do not specify the font objective size of your scope. That matters!
Rich, you are probably right that you were able to zoom in and "see" the point of the horn better. The image itself was probably not as "bright" however. There is a point of diminishing return while zooming. Because the exit pupil of the scope is getting smaller as you increase the magnification of the scope. At some point the image will not be bright enough for you to determine anything. This point also depends on the ability of your eyes and as we age our eyes do not see as well in the dark because older pupils do not dilate as much. Also, you are judging the quality of the coatings on the optics more than anything in your tests. Which is important. But if you compare a couple of PST scopes with different objective lens sizes and magnification ranges. The coatings would be the same and your test results somewhat different.
This link is to a good explanation of these factors from an astronomical site. it's a good quick read.
https://www.astronomics.com/spotting-scope-specifications_t.aspx
Canhunter35
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In rich's Defense I've also observed with doing late night tests in the dark that I could read my target better if I turned up the magnification but to me it seemed darker, but the extra magnification helped discern it in the dark.
Then the play the devils advocate, Last spring me and a buddy's and my wife were hunting beavers, it got dark enough that he could not see a beaver with his 6-24 sightron s3, my wife could not see it with her 4-14 Burris, but I could see it with my 30year old vari x 2, 3-9 scope and I had to use the lowest magnification.
I think the difference is quality scopes are so good at picking up light that more magnification seems better until it gets utterly dark enough that there simply isn't enough light for any magnification....that makes sense in my head but not after I wrote it. Lol oh well
Then the play the devils advocate, Last spring me and a buddy's and my wife were hunting beavers, it got dark enough that he could not see a beaver with his 6-24 sightron s3, my wife could not see it with her 4-14 Burris, but I could see it with my 30year old vari x 2, 3-9 scope and I had to use the lowest magnification.
I think the difference is quality scopes are so good at picking up light that more magnification seems better until it gets utterly dark enough that there simply isn't enough light for any magnification....that makes sense in my head but not after I wrote it. Lol oh well
Rich Coyle
Well-Known Member
What I'm trying to say, and failing, is if you use your 5-25X as low light sets in and can see something on 5X and it disappears due to poor light, you can turn it up to say 10X or 12X and continue seeing it. Same thing with your 4-14X. I have no idea hat quality your 5-25X and your 4-14X are. The only way you can know which is better is to use an optics chart for resolution and something with a good edge for low light comparison.
