this savage is driving me nuts

Discussion in 'Gunsmithing' started by tony stark, Jul 27, 2008.

  1. tony stark

    tony stark Member

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    i've bought a savage model 12 btcss (thumbhole .223). i noticed during the break in that the groups were large (3"+) from the very beginning.
    i was dry firing, practicing without ammo and i noticed that when i would press the trigger the crosshairs in the scope would bounce all the way out of the target box. the rifle didn't move but the crosshairs did.
    i checked all of the mouting hardware and it was tight.
    i checked to make sure that the rings were lined up and they were.
    and the bounce was still there, i took the scope off of the savage and put it on my ar rifle and no bouce. i changed out the scope and the new one did it to.
    i changed out the mounting hardware from a 2 piece burris base with leoupold rings to a 1 piece winchester base with leoupold rings.
    no bouce was detected and i was able to shoot some less than one inch groups.
    i am out at the range this afternoon, thinking that the problem is gone.
    i am testing ammo and the groups go form sub inch to 3 inches.
    i check and sure enough the bounce is back in the crosshairs.
    i took it to the gun shop in town and they tested it with a brand new leupold and it does it to.
    is ther an inherent problem with the savage model 12?
    after trying 2 different sets of mounting hardware and 2 different scopes what is the next step?
     
  2. EddieHarren

    EddieHarren Well-Known Member

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    Savage

    Bedding.
     

  3. adam

    adam Well-Known Member

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    I had the exact same problem with a 12 bvss. Turned out that the action screws loosened up. I didn't notice till I was packing up, and moved the gun by grabing the barrel.

    I have noticed this problem with even some new from the factory savages. Tourque it down properly will remove the problem.

    Even better is to bed with pillars. Your tourque on the action screws will then probably be more stable.
     
  4. tony stark

    tony stark Member

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    okay! maybe i am seeing the picture

    so maybe what i am watching when i see the scope hairs jumping around on the target is not a movement of the scope but the whole barreled action moving around in the stock?

    when i fasten the action screws down, are there any torque specs to go by or is good and snug okay?

    is there a way to test this, putting a dail indicator on the barrel or something?
     
  5. EddieHarren

    EddieHarren Well-Known Member

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    If the rifle is not bedded and, has only those pathetic little "ferrules" as pillars, then exact torqueing will be impossible to maintain. Keep it simple and hand tighten the screws. Then shoot the rifle or, dry fire again to see if the crosshairs jump.
     
  6. JUDD

    JUDD Well-Known Member

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    Bedding

    " had the exact same problem with a 12 bvss. Turned out that the action screws loosened up. I didn't notice till I was packing up, and moved the gun by grabing the barrel.

    I have noticed this problem with even some new from the factory savages. Tourque it down properly will remove the problem.

    Even better is to bed with pillars. Your tourque on the action screws will then probably be more stable."


    I would bet this will fix your problem. I had the same issue with a Tctical model that was suppsoed to be pillar bedded from the factory. Does it group like 1 high then 1 low and then 1 back up where the first shot was and so on and so on? You are shooting the first shot with lets say the action slid all the way forward. As you shoot the action slides all the way back.You shoot the next shot with it in the back position.Once the shot goes off it moves back to the forward spot. Hence giving you two or thre seperate groups.

    Spend the money get it bedded. Tighting the screws will compress the stock and only get worse over time....trust me I went thru this...I pilar bedded it and my headaches are now gone.
     
  7. tony stark

    tony stark Member

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    the definition of accuracy

    if i send the rifle back to savage, should they fix this problem?
    i called them to see what bedding the rifle would do to my warranty.
    they said if i bedded it, void nada, it's mine.

    it's mine now (i mean i payed for it) but if they are going to do the same substandard thing that they did before, then i am just wasting time.

    i am just venting and am tring to figure out want to do.

    the thumhole stock fits me perfectly, and i really like the gun, i would like it even more if the doggone thing would shoot.

    i guess that this is not my definition of accuracy
     
  8. Roll-Yur-Own

    Roll-Yur-Own Well-Known Member

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    Savage will only tighten the screws. Take it to a smith and have it pillar bedded.
     
  9. britz

    britz Well-Known Member

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    I am hopeing you are wrong because I sent my 12 fvl 22-250 back to savage through the dealer (scheels all sports) 5 weeks ago because it wouldn't shoot. It should be back any minute and I'll fill you in if they did any barrel lapping or anything like that.
     
  10. edge

    edge Well-Known Member

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    Re: the definition of accuracy

    I suspect that you did not speak with the correct person at Savage. IMO, their customer service is second to none :)




    edge.
     
  11. tony stark

    tony stark Member

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    i called Joe at savage, he was not in his office so i left a message.
    he returned my call and my wife told him that i am hard to reach during the day.
    now for the impressed part,
    he took his time and called me back after hours.
    i explained what i was going thru and wants to see the rifle.
    now for the really impressed part, he made arrangments for ups to pick up the rifle saying if somthing is wrong with it he is going to see that it is fixed.

    i am impressed:):):)
     
  12. RandyB

    RandyB Member

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    I have seen several Savage laminated stocks with the factory pillars that were split. The laminate had seperated causing a hairline crack that allowed the pillars to move in the stock. The screws are tight bearing against the pillars (as they should) but the pillars are moving slightly causing BIG accuracy problems. The factory pillars are pressed in and not glued (BVSS stocks anyway). Draw an imaginary line from the center of the front pillar to the rear pillar and inspect carefully with magnifier under light with the stock off the rifle to see if this is the problem. If so the stock can be repaired and be usable. I suggest all Savage owners of fifles with laminated stocks check this. This may not be your problem but if I had it I would check that first. If memory serves me I have repaired 3 BVSS stocks and 1 low profile stock with this problem. Good luck, RandyB.
     
  13. tony stark

    tony stark Member

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    what wood factory (savage) stocks pillare bedded?
     
  14. foreign

    foreign Well-Known Member

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    hey mate you could pillar bed and glass bed it yourself and safe some $