Anvil11-87
Well-Known Member
I'm looking at getting a competition seater die for my .308 loads. Any opinions on RCBS vs Redding dies??
I'm not surprised. A lot of how good the reloaded ammo ends up depends on the techniques used for a given set of tools. Which is why there's a few good tools out there for us to choose from.I' ve tried a lot of die sets and die combonations over decades of reloading to otain straight necks and straight seating. My best is a combination of anyone's body die and a Lee Collet neck die followed by a Forster BR seater, with or without the micrometer head. (Note that no part of that includes an RCBS die.)
I'm looking at getting a competition seater die for my .308 loads. Any opinions on RCBS vs Redding dies??
Forster is a better choice, either their Benchrest or Ultraseat die give excellent concentricity results.
Of the two you mentioned, Redding is the right choice. Same design as the Forster.
Sierra Bullets gets best results (cartridge straightness and best accuracy) using Redding full bushing or standard Redding full length sizing dies. They agreed with me that the RCBS versions of both dies would perform the same.
Four things:
No, I'm talking about fired case sizing dies. Not about bullet seating dies.First, I think you mean Redding's copy of Forster's full length sleeves in their seaters rather than bushings in the sizers. ??
My old RCBS standard bullet seating dies put bullets in .308 Win. cases just as straight as my old Wilson chamber type seating die. Those bullets are in virtual perfect alignment with the case neck which happens with all seating dies.Second, I disagree about the value of the RCBS/Hornady/old Lyman PA dies with short sleeves that ONLY align the bullets and necks since they are not any better fitted than most common dies.
If you're talking about seating dies, that may be true. I've never used a Redding or Forster seater except for a short test that showed they did pretty good.Third, common dies are, on average, pretty good so even the Forster/Redding dies may not make any great difference in concentricity all by themselves.
Good point.Four(th), contrary to poplar opinion, an unskilled reloader won't make good ammo no matter how much his tools cost nor how precisely he measures his powder charges. But a skilled reloader can make good shooting stuff on virtually anything.
There are a few hundred (thousand?) top ranked long range rifle shooters around the world that disagree with this premise. Best example was when a few of us developed the load for Sierra's first Palma bullet then made several thousand rounds of it on two Dillon 1050 progressives. Metered powder charges with a 3/10ths grain spread, bullet runout up to 3/1000ths in new Winchester cases and Fed. 210M primers. After a few thousand rounds were shot in the first match using them, a few dozen folks from all over said it easily held 1/2 MOA at 600 yards. Their barrels had different chamber, bore and groove dimensions as well as different barrel contours. All on 5 or 6 different actions. Even a good lot of commercial match .308 Win. ammo would shoot inside 4 inches all day long in a variety of M1 and M14 match conditioned service rifles. Arsenal made lots of ammo used in international Palma competition is very accurate in virtually all rifle-barrel combinations.Good load development is critical for good performance. A load can be as precisely assembled as a Swiss watch but if it's not matched to the firearm the accuracy will be atrocious!
Changing all that stuff's exactly what happened after Varget became the powder of choice for .308's shooting the Palma 155-gr. bullet. Charge weights varied from 45 to 47 grains in both my Palma rifles for cases weighing between 150 and 170 grains. Both the very mild RWS 5341 primer as well as Fed. 210M and Rem. 7.5 small rifle primer was used. Depending on how much throat had been eroded away, the three barrels, each with a different contour and length needed a spread of about 20 thousandths in cartridge OAL to have the bullet seat about 5/1000ths deeper in the case when chambered for a constant start-up resistance for each shot. All combinations shot about 5/10ths MOA at 600, 6/10ths at 800 and 7/10ths MOA at 1000.But, change the powder, primer and charge, keep the same good bullet but change the OAL by 20 thou. Then use the same dies, press and methods precisely and see what happens. Just meanimg that no matter how precisely the cartridge is assembled, if it is a bad load all that precision won't make it shoot good!