"Inherently more accurate"

Michael Hathorn said:
Not the person behind it...I own way more rifles than just this one! Way more
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This means nothing.

Michael Hathorn said:
Have several, that shoot tighter than this gun, at 600 yards.
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This does. If you can eliminate human error,...

Check the easy stuff first. Barrel bind, action screws, scope and hardware, Thorough copper removal, carbon removal, Bore scope and start again if barrel and chamber look good. No dice? Send it back or rebarrel.
 
Theres definitely accuracy in case design. 1000yd Match results are good but you also have to realize different conditions play a role in what or who won that particular match. To really compare cartridges it has to be done in the best conditions you can find to allow them to shoot to their potential. Shooting them in a match comes down to the tune, shooter, relay draw, conditions, ext. A 4" group may win, but they are capable of much much better. Many of the top shooters will not take a rifle to a match thats not capable of mid to low 2" 5 shot groups or better. We have Benchrest rifles in cases from 6BRA up to 338 lapua improved and play with different designs often. The 338 Norma imp is showing a lot of promise and looks like the next one worth trying. In equal rifles, the 338s will not touch the 6mms for raw accuracy at 1k, but at 2k thats another story. The mid sized 30s show potential to run with a 6mm, but on average are a little bigger. Theres some other factors involved there however. Even comparing just 6s, the 6x47 has been tried often but it just wont agg with a 6br/bra/dasher. The dasher is at the larger end of what will agg competitively in a 6mm case. So yes, there is accuracy in a case. In my opinion its mostly volume. Shoulder angles, taper, neck length, can effect bolt thrust and throat wear but are not much of a role in raw accuracy. In 1k BR almost everything you can think of has been tried and many still are being tried. You just wont hear about it unless it works. And it wont even make it to a match if it didnt work in testing. A lot of people are making assumptions about a sport they have no first hand experience with. Over the years the winning cartridges have consistently gotten smaller, and its not been by accident. There are different factors involved in long range hunting, so the cases we are using in BR are not really the best choice, but doesnt mean you cant take everything you learn in BR and apply it to long range hunting rifles. Accuracy is accuracy no matter what you use the rifle for.
 
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Alex Wheeler said:
Theres definitely accuracy in case design. 1000yd Match results are good but you also have to realize different conditions play a role in what or who won that particular match. To really compare cartridges it has to be done in the best conditions you can find to allow them to shoot to their potential. Shooting them in a match comes down to the tune, shooter, relay draw, conditions, ext. A 4" group may win, but they are capable of much much better. Many of the top shooters will not take a rifle to a match thats not capable of mid to low 2" 5 shot groups or better. We have Benchrest rifles in cases from 6BRA up to 338 lapua improved and play with different designs often. The 338 Norma imp is showing a lot of promise and looks like the next one worth trying. In equal rifles, the 338s will not touch the 6mms for raw accuracy at 1k, but at 2k thats another story. The mid sized 30s show potential to run with a 6mm, but on average are a little bigger. Theres some other factors involved there however. Even comparing just 6s, the 6x47 has been tried often but it just wont agg with a 6br/bra/dasher. The dasher is at the larger end of what will agg competitively in a 6mm case. So yes, there is accuracy in a case. In my opinion its mostly volume. Shoulder angles, taper, neck length, can effect bolt thrust and throat wear but are not much of a role in raw accuracy. In 1k BR almost everything you can think of has been tried and many still are being tried. You just wont hear about it unless it works. And it wont even make it to a match if it didnt work in testing. A lot of people are making assumptions about a sport they have no first hand experience with. Over the years the winning cartridges have consistently gotten smaller, and its not been by accident. There are different factors involved in long range hunting, so the cases we are using in BR are not really the best choice, but doesnt mean you cant take everything you learn in BR and apply it to long range hunting rifles. Accuracy is accuracy no matter what you use the rifle for.
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Two consistent top performers like the 300wsm and 6.5-284 seem to transfer well. Thanks for the insight.
 
I only really hunt elk, and in open windy country. So for me I dont want a 6.5 or a 300 wsm myself. And honestly the 6.5-284 has been falling out of favor for quite some time. I have owned 3 or 4 300 wsms. Very accurate but harder to cold bore at 1k in real world conditions than a big 30 or 338. The trajectory not only ads windage but makes ranging and judging other environmentals more critical. In reality, even though my 338 has less raw accuracy than a 30 or 6mm, it will out cold bore them considerably simply because that bullet is moved less not only wind, but all the other factors that play a role in poi. I wish more guys had access to shoot at long range because its really an eye opener. Heres a great test for those of you that have access. Take 2 rifles you want to compare. Zero them at 1k or what ever distance and dont touch the scopes. Shoot a shot out of each throughout the day, and even better come back at the same time multiple days. I think you will be amazed at the poi shifts you will see, not just for obvious windage reasons but vertical changes that can be very hard to explain or predict. I can promise you if you do this, you will become a fan of 338s :)
 
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I remember when Leo and Tom where setting records with 300 Wsm,then went and did same with 6 dasher.Leo was poster child back then for NF with his 1000+ speed goat.Tom has stacks of targets in the 2's for 5 shots.Like you say, think you posted a vid of Tom shooting 2000 yrd shoot with 338lai,that guy can send em
 
Alex Wheeler said:
I only really hunt elk, and in open windy country. So for me I dont want a 6.5 or a 300 wsm myself. And honestly the 6.5-284 has been falling out of favor for quite some time. I have owned 3 or 4 300 wsms. Very accurate but harder to cold bore at 1k in real world conditions than a big 30 or 338. The trajectory not only ads windage but makes ranging and judging other environmentals more critical. In reality, even though my 338 has less raw accuracy than a 30 or 6mm, it will out cold bore them considerably simply because that bullet is moved less not only wind, but all the other factors that play a role in poi. I wish more guys had access to shoot at long range because its really an eye opener. Heres a great test for those of you that have access. Take 2 rifles you want to compare. Zero them at 1k or what ever distance and dont touch the scopes. Shoot a shot out of each throughout the day, and even better come back at the same time multiple days. I think you will be amazed at the poi shifts you will see, not just for obvious windage reasons but vertical changes that can be very hard to explain or predict. I can promise you if you do this, you will become a fan of 338s :)
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I like my 28 Nosler for moose and elk
 
I would say it depends on what rifle the cartridge is chambered in.

In light weight mass manufactured rifles I would say a lighter recoiling round with dimensions that naturally will chamber and seat the bullet more consistantly squared with the bullets loaded for the cartridge would be inherently more accurate. Doesn't mean it will be better for shooting in wind or anything, but you will hear about more people with off the shelf rifles shooting small groups at 100yrds. 6.5 cm, 308... seem to do this more in hunting rifles then the big magnums, but also are light recoiling sa rounds that get put in heavier rifles.
 
I used that term once... Ha...

Now when I throw it out there Im normally talking about my self on a good day,,, not the 10 or so outtings when I couldn't hit the broadside of a barn...

That's when I'm inherently in-accurate... LOL

But yes,,, with the right cartridge,,, optic,,, rifle and the whole package that fits you like a glove """betters""" the odds of being more consistant...

Consistency and accuracy go hand in hand most of the time...

Cheers from the North
 
Alex Wheeler said:
Theres definitely accuracy in case design. 1000yd Match results are good but you also have to realize different conditions play a role in what or who won that particular match. To really compare cartridges it has to be done in the best conditions you can find to allow them to shoot to their potential. Shooting them in a match comes down to the tune, shooter, relay draw, conditions, ext. A 4" group may win, but they are capable of much much better. Many of the top shooters will not take a rifle to a match thats not capable of mid to low 2" 5 shot groups or better. We have Benchrest rifles in cases from 6BRA up to 338 lapua improved and play with different designs often. The 338 Norma imp is showing a lot of promise and looks like the next one worth trying. In equal rifles, the 338s will not touch the 6mms for raw accuracy at 1k, but at 2k thats another story. The mid sized 30s show potential to run with a 6mm, but on average are a little bigger. Theres some other factors involved there however. Even comparing just 6s, the 6x47 has been tried often but it just wont agg with a 6br/bra/dasher. The dasher is at the larger end of what will agg competitively in a 6mm case. So yes, there is accuracy in a case. In my opinion its mostly volume. Shoulder angles, taper, neck length, can effect bolt thrust and throat wear but are not much of a role in raw accuracy. In 1k BR almost everything you can think of has been tried and many still are being tried. You just wont hear about it unless it works. And it wont even make it to a match if it didnt work in testing. A lot of people are making assumptions about a sport they have no first hand experience with. Over the years the winning cartridges have consistently gotten smaller, and its not been by accident. There are different factors involved in long range hunting, so the cases we are using in BR are not really the best choice, but doesnt mean you cant take everything you learn in BR and apply it to long range hunting rifles. Accuracy is accuracy no matter what you use the rifle for.
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I hear yha Alex...

The 338 Lapua is definitely holding its own,,, and in the artical in the bottom section is the continuing progress on the 300 Winchester Magnum project so they can get it to reach out there as well...

https://www.tactical-life.com/gear/ammo/338-lapua-magnum-long-range/

I think your onto something in the distance stuff for sure...

Cheers from the North
 

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