A friend of mine at local match yesterday shooting 6BRDX (LG) said he had to dial in 7 MOA for wind. Tough day. He got in a shoot off in HG (6.5x284) took 3rd behind a 284 and 300WSM.Because why not have ~9-10 more grains of case capacity. Be competitive, not winI'm not making 10-shot 3" groups at 1,000 yards. I used a 243 and I'm going up to AI, not down to Dasher.
GUESS WHAT!
- Thread starter Coyote Shadow Tracker
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We're waiting a full report once you've got it operational!
I like hearing the driveway alarm go off and see the UPS or FedX pull up and have a package for us (especially when waiting for something for months to get).I figured I had a 50/50 chance on a V4 or a shot marker. lol
I'm waiting on a shot marker myself.
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Surprised that you haven't had a Shot Marker already. We have a Shot Marker at our Range for a few years and haven't used it yet. Several of our group have used it a few times and they love it. I need get it setup, learn it and use it. Get real time results. We were going to finish the target frame with metal covers over the sensors in case of a bullet strike. As with every new Tool to use shooting it is the setup and take down time. New technology to learn but you can get your shooting results and record on your Android tablet. Use it along with a Labradar, Kestrel can help improve your shooting.
At this time there are so many new tools and technology for shooting it is overwhelming. You basically need to be a full time shooter to have the time to use all these new tools/tech/processes. AND all this new technology/tools are made to save time.
I like to throw my mat down, setup my rifle with cartridges, my DOPE log, Kestrel and start squeezing the trigger. To do it correctly when I have time and not lazy I setup my spotting scope, Labradar, get out the Side by Side to drive to the 1k, setup Paper, paint steel, "NEED to start using the Shot Marker", have cleaning gear ready, ect. We are lucky to have a range outside our shop so load development is real time. Don't need to drive back and forth to a range to test loads. Then going to the PRS/1K range is just setup and shoot.
Rflshootr
Well-Known Member
Good luck with your new toy....sorry about the hijack. Be sure to let us know if it's everything you expected and waited so long for and if the 1 kernel of powder gives more consistent numbers.
Rflshooter
No didn't take it that way as a hijack. Like seeing how members get involved and share information. One subject Segway's into another and discussions lead to answering questions. Just making a point on how posting about a package can lead to weighing powder, FPS, Horespower and ES/SD. So many things happen between putting a kernel of powder on the scale to the bullet hitting the paper/target. Good discussions and answers!
Thanks
Hugnot
Well-Known Member
Are the squirrels black or do they climb on black trees?
My thinking is that there are many other variables that would affect MV in addition to powder charge variations. I would attempt to anaylze group shape in an effort to predict (confidence levels) divergence at range increments. A read of the Berger manual, pages 140 - 147 gets into statistical analysis of targets. The graph shown in page 142, frequency distribution - (bell shaped curve - remember when smart guys had test scores on right side, the majority in upper middle, & struggling students on left side (D's & F's)) The illustration on page 144 shows a shot up target with circles representing confidence intervals with group center indicated as +.
Quote, page 144 - "Note that if the vertical SD & horizontal SD are significantly different from each other, you could chose to apply them independently. which would result in ellipses instead of circles." Taking a look at the orientation of an ellipsoidal display of confidence intervals it would be possible to get an idea of the confidence levels of either up/down (Y) or left/right(X) hits at extended ranges. An evaluation of confidence levels using data with extreme powder measurement accuracy would give some idea of the validity of extreme powder measurements - all other factors would be operational. Bulk data.
I remember back then, in a 12th grade calc class, our crafty teacher took our quarterly exam booklets and neatly stacked them in a pile. He then said " how about I grade these this way" ?, he then tossed the whole works (overhand toss, edge forward) up a flight of enclosed stairs in the back of the class room. A blast of paper flew at the stairs. a few books reached the top, the bulk of books landed in mid level, and a few were at the bottom. The good (serious) students were horrified. I thought it was funny.
My thinking is that there are many other variables that would affect MV in addition to powder charge variations. I would attempt to anaylze group shape in an effort to predict (confidence levels) divergence at range increments. A read of the Berger manual, pages 140 - 147 gets into statistical analysis of targets. The graph shown in page 142, frequency distribution - (bell shaped curve - remember when smart guys had test scores on right side, the majority in upper middle, & struggling students on left side (D's & F's)) The illustration on page 144 shows a shot up target with circles representing confidence intervals with group center indicated as +.
Quote, page 144 - "Note that if the vertical SD & horizontal SD are significantly different from each other, you could chose to apply them independently. which would result in ellipses instead of circles." Taking a look at the orientation of an ellipsoidal display of confidence intervals it would be possible to get an idea of the confidence levels of either up/down (Y) or left/right(X) hits at extended ranges. An evaluation of confidence levels using data with extreme powder measurement accuracy would give some idea of the validity of extreme powder measurements - all other factors would be operational. Bulk data.
I remember back then, in a 12th grade calc class, our crafty teacher took our quarterly exam booklets and neatly stacked them in a pile. He then said " how about I grade these this way" ?, he then tossed the whole works (overhand toss, edge forward) up a flight of enclosed stairs in the back of the class room. A blast of paper flew at the stairs. a few books reached the top, the bulk of books landed in mid level, and a few were at the bottom. The good (serious) students were horrified. I thought it was funny.
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WYO300RUM
Well-Known Member
- Joined
- Jan 4, 2013
- Messages
- 75
That box is looks very familiar .
Received mine a few weeks back. Hope to set it up in a couple weeks and start playing with it.
.Received mine a few weeks back. Hope to set it up in a couple weeks and start playing with it.
Orange Dust
Well-Known Member
I have been promoting that regularly since I abandoned my first 7MM STW due to lack of 8MM brass. Should be part of EVERY rifle purchase, and mandatory for a wildcat, esp one made from uncommon brass.
QuietTexan
Well-Known Member
The point being made was that a winning 100-200-300 yard bench rest load is highly dependent on a lot of factors that do not necessarily translate to being the things that make winning 1,000 yard, 1 mile, or longer loads.
The 6PPC is a championship winning round at 100-200-300 yards. But the fractional MOA holes don't happen with just any bullet. Bullet design is just as critical on the short course as the long.
The Berger 6BR Column is a flat based bullet, as are many short range bench rest bullets. The lack of boat tail is actually a benefit at short range for a number of reasons. Better consistency between bullets, shorter bullets stabilize at a slower twist rate so they spin slower, and the real wrinkle - BC doesn't matter in the sense that it doesn't need to be high because the target is close, so as long as it's consistent you're fine. The BC of this particular bullet stays ever so slightly more consistent as velocity drops, even though it's what most long range shooters would think is an abysmal rating.
If you put a 65gn Berget Target BT into a 6PPC side by side with a 64.2gn Column bullet, on the average, the boat tailed bullet will shoot a larger group, be that from bullet stability, bullet rotation due to requiring a faster bore twist/being slightly less stable, or other things. To win at 100 yards, you need every advantage, so if a bullet shots on average a smaller group, you'll use it and not care that it might destabilize and fall out of the sky like it hit a brick wall at 600 yards due to lack of a boat tail and having the BC of a Buick.
Then if you go all the way up to a large, 100+gn 6mm bullet to get a maximized BC to shoot over distance and through the transonic zone, the 300 yard hole will be larger still, but at that point doubling the BC with the longer bullet predicts it will get to the 1,000 yard target a whole lot better than the super-precise short range bullet.
If the 300 yard group is 1.0" but the 1000 yard group is 8", do you can that the 300 yard group is several times larger than the smallest possible?
