Did I just make a mistake?

If you're convinced Leupold scopes are poor quality then don't buy one. Simple as that. I've used a number of them and never had any problems, so I will continue to use them based on my personal experience. I like them because they're light weight and have good glass for the money.
 
I used to be a raging Leupold fan boy, the need for turrets that track, return to zero and stay together broke me from them especially once I started looking at the glass, their warrenty is now pretty much industry standard so why pay a premium for a product that is 20 years or more behind similar priced optics, man I with I could go back to them but I get bit every time.
 
If you're convinced Leupold scopes are poor quality then don't buy one. Simple as that. I've used a number of them and never had any problems, so I will continue to use them based on my personal experience. I like them because they're light weight and have good glass for the money.

I suspect I am being misunderstood as to the intention and motivation behind my reasons for originating this question in the first place. Until I recently was made aware of the rather large number of threads (by anyone standards) suggesting Leupolds QC had begun to slip I was stead fast in my belief that ALL of the scopes Leupold had ever produced were of the same excellent quality and durability standards as were the six quite old long discontinued VariX-II's that I presently own as well as the two nearly as equally old and discontinued Japanese made Wind River roof prism binos have been and continue to be.

My faith in Leupold is why it never ever occurred to me to bother to research Leupolds QC of their optics. Once I did I found a alarming number of threads dating back to as early as 2005 claiming leupold had gone through a sort of changing of the old guard if you will and the new management had enacted new cost savings policies concerning the manufacturing of their scopes most notable of which was the incorporation of Chinese made components in the internal workings of their scopes especially in the erector systems.

I even found a older 12 or 15 page long thread here at LRH discussing at length the same EXACT subject I as my thread concerning had a serious degradation of Leupold QC occurred. If anyone cared to go to the link I posted that takes you to a 7 page long thread about Leupold QC also.

I also thought I had made it plane I was in no way bashing Leupold and wasn't trying to afford an opportunity for it to be done, as I have stated repeatedly I own a large number of Leupold optics all of which have served me with excellence.

My purpose was to get the opinions of more experienced members here on weather or not Leupolds QC had actually become questionable since post 2005 or some time during the last 10 years or so as after reading pages upon pages of people sighting serious issues with upper end VX-III's and VX-3i's and giving large amount of detailed information to substantiate their complaints concerning poor Leupold QC, as I said these claims included the author posting their name and the names of the person or persons they dealt with at Leupold including the problem with their scope and the repair sheet leupold sent back to them with their scope post repair.

I didn't base my decision to return the VX-3i I bought on a few or even a dozen or so negative posts, I returned it because I read page upon page after page of negative posts concerning a alleged reduction of QC at Leupold that date from as early as 2005 and continued to present day. I admit it ran the risk of a bit of knee jerk reaction on my part, but this scope who ever I end up buying it from will be my primary hunting scope and no other piece of equipment I will ever use on any rifle hunt occupies a higher level of importance in deciding the success or failure of my hunts than it. We rifle hunters all face one inescapable fact withal rifles we have in hand at any and all moments of all hunts, if the scope for what ever reason fails us the rifle in our hands instantly transforms into nothing more than a very expensive club.

I also did similar searches for Vortex and even Sightron and yes some negative threads popped up but not in the same no# as Leupold, can this difference be attributed to Leupold making a much larger no# of scopes than Vortex or Sightron? I can not answer that.

Everyone is entitled to their choice of which scope to buy or not. I also came to a realization of sorts in I'm beginning to strongly suspect there is a large difference in the reliability of "set it and forget it" type scopes which describe all the ones I presently own and ones designed specifically with target style adjustment knobs for elevation and wind, for obvious reasons the adjustable scopes are far more prone to problems than SAF types.

Bottom line IMHO based on all available information I will not be buying a Leupold any time soon that has target style adjustment knobs. I'm sure others (quite possibly more informed and undoubtedly more knowledgeable than I) will not share my opinion and I respect that completely.
 
I bought one of their scopes that had a turret set up in yardage for the 223. I wanted to use moa so I called them and ask about buying a turret. They sent me one no charge. This VX-LR scope works flawlessly on my 223 AR. Thanks Leupold.
 
Perhaps I did misunderstand your reason for posting the thread. Certainly anyone can buy whatever they wish. I own several brands myself. The problem is you based your research on a very unscientific sample and made a decison about an entire brand based on a handful of threads.
Then, with no personal experience of your own to contribute, you opted to "publish" the results of your "findings". Why? All you accomplished was to intimate that your exhaustive search of supposedly qualified posters proves Leupold quality control is bad. What purpose does it serve to regurgitate other people's opinions?
So now you have added to this body of internet "evidence" that Leupold is bad.
To be fair to Leupold- they arguably have more scopes in the field than all the other makers combined- and they still warranty them. Of course there are more disappointed owners- there are a LOT more owners overall. If I did internet research on Ford and Tesla I'm fairly certain I'd find more complaints about Ford. Does that mean Fords are all junk?
I'm not gonna say Leupold hasn't cut a corner or two and made some mistakes. But I will say they stand behind their products.
I'm sure there are lots of wonderful optics choices out there- buy one and tell everyone on the internet how awesome it is before you even mount it on a rifle. Then we can reference your opinion to justify buying a 'Nitron Benderski X7". They must be the best scopes ever made since I never read a negative comment on a bulletin board.
 
Perhaps I did misunderstand your reason for posting the thread. Certainly anyone can buy whatever they wish. I own several brands myself. The problem is you based your research on a very unscientific sample and made a decison about an entire brand based on a handful of threads.
Then, with no personal experience of your own to contribute, you opted to "publish" the results of your "findings". Why? All you accomplished was to intimate that your exhaustive search of supposedly qualified posters proves Leupold quality control is bad. What purpose does it serve to regurgitate other people's opinions?
So now you have added to this body of internet "evidence" that Leupold is bad.
To be fair to Leupold- they arguably have more scopes in the field than all the other makers combined- and they still warranty them. Of course there are more disappointed owners- there are a LOT more owners overall. If I did internet research on Ford and Tesla I'm fairly certain I'd find more complaints about Ford. Does that mean Fords are all junk?
I'm not gonna say Leupold hasn't cut a corner or two and made some mistakes. But I will say they stand behind their products.
I'm sure there are lots of wonderful optics choices out there- buy one and tell everyone on the internet how awesome it is before you even mount it on a rifle. Then we can reference your opinion to justify buying a 'Nitron Benderski X7". They must be the best scopes ever made since I never read a negative comment on a bulletin board.

This post reminds me of the posters who tell us they have forty Leupolds and have been using them for forty years and never had a problem with any of them. My personal experience is I bought one and put it on the firearm. It lasted about 300 rounds. They replaced it with a better one. Is it possible the posters who never have problems never take them out and hunt with them?
 
Hey Rich. I appreciate what you are saying. If you had a bad experience with a product I'd love to hear details. Especially if it helps me make a better decision about my next purchase.
What makes no sense to me- is posting a message saying many other people said bad things- so I decided to not have anything to do with that product. Why would you feel the need to share this? Are you trying to recruit others to your way of thinking?Perhaps a pat on the head for making a great decision?
If you tell me YOU bought a scope, used it, and it failed because the turret broke I would consider that useful info. I would be really interested in learning what exactly is breaking so I could learn if the maker is correcting it in the latest upgrades.
If you tell me you heard a 'bunch" of guys had some kinda problem so you never tried it- it really doesn't contribute other than brand bashing.
I don't have any particular brand loyalty. I just think you should be fair to the company before posting a diatribe about the demise of their brand.
I'm just a hunter. But I enjoy learning about the latest and greatest stuff from the many experienced folks on this site. If a certain brand has turrets fail because they are too 'light duty' - now THAT would be good to know. That would be bad design, not quality control. If the turret is a solid design but haphazardly machined or assembled- that's another matter.
I wasn't trying to offend the OP- Im just proposing that it would be more fruitful to post one's first hand experiences.
 
Coopershawk,

I don't remember exactly but I think it was the field of view started shrinking. That means one of the lenses was moving. The replacement scope is still going strong after thousands of rounds.
 
I've got five or so current model Leupold's with more owned and sold throughout the last few years, and surprisingly enough I've never sent a Leupold back because of failure. I've sent a lot of scopes back in the last few years, some mid range and some premium, for defects or failure, but none of them have been Leupold.
 
Perhaps I did misunderstand your reason for posting the thread. Certainly anyone can buy whatever they wish. I own several brands myself. The problem is you based your research on a very unscientific sample and made a decison about an entire brand based on a handful of threads.
Then, with no personal experience of your own to contribute, you opted to "publish" the results of your "findings". Why? All you accomplished was to intimate that your exhaustive search of supposedly qualified posters proves Leupold quality control is bad. What purpose does it serve to regurgitate other people's opinions?
So now you have added to this body of internet "evidence" that Leupold is bad.
To be fair to Leupold- they arguably have more scopes in the field than all the other makers combined- and they still warranty them. Of course there are more disappointed owners- there are a LOT more owners overall. If I did internet research on Ford and Tesla I'm fairly certain I'd find more complaints about Ford. Does that mean Fords are all junk?
I'm not gonna say Leupold hasn't cut a corner or two and made some mistakes. But I will say they stand behind their products.
I'm sure there are lots of wonderful optics choices out there- buy one and tell everyone on the internet how awesome it is before you even mount it on a rifle. Then we can reference your opinion to justify buying a 'Nitron Benderski X7". They must be the best scopes ever made since I never read a negative comment on a bulletin board.

No offence meant, but you might wish to consider reading my posted statements again, as I in no way made any unsubstantiated claims concerning Leupold QC. Read my postings and you will see for yourself what I based my concerns on. As a matter of fact you can do a search here at LRH and you should find the same thread that was IIRC over 20 pages long that quite a few members here expressed displeasure with the lower end Leupold scopes such as the VX II's and VX IIIs having more instances of not adjusting or returning or maintaining zero reliably and not as reliably as the higher end Leupolds.

AS far as being "Scientific" in my data, would you sir be so kind as to tell me exactly how anyone can gather evidence with the level of accuracy needed to be certified as "Scientific" unless one was to buy scopes from the majority of scope manufacturers in the same price point as a VX-3i then subject them to a brace of tests needed to accurately evaluate them?

I can not speak for anyone but myself, but if I could afford to buy enough of scopes to perform such a test I wouldn't be here asking advice, I would just buy a S&B scope and call it a day. I like the other 90-99% of people have little other choice but to come to forums such as this and ask advice form people we hope are FAR more experienced than we are to help us make the best choices in spending our in my case VERY hard earned money.

I research all my major or important purchases the same way if they are rifle scopes or a vehicle, I use the internet to find out as much information good and bad as I can on the item. I might be going out on a limb here but I'm willing to but you do pretty much the same thing.

Unfortunately scopes unlike vehicles, or house hold appliances don't have a "Consumer Reports" type magazine that gives fair and unbiased reviews of them. No I like the other 95-99%+ of hunters and shooters almost entirely on the internet to gather information to on which to base our to buy decisions on and for better or worse that information can never even approach the threshold of being "scientific".

All a person such as myself can do is perform multiple goggle searches and post requests in forums such as this one for people to share their first hand experiences and when it comes down to it you have no way of knowing if the person is being honest and unbiased or not. IMHO all you can do is gather as many first had experiences that people share with you and base your findings on weather the majority of the data allows you to conclude the product in question is reliable or not.

In the case of my research into weather or not the VX-3i model of scopes were reliable enough for me to place my faith in, I based it on not an over whelming no# of negative posts, but again this in MY OPINION only, there were enough negative posts that I shouldn't keep the VX-3i I had ordered because I needed more research to give me the confidence I require to place the fate of my most important hunts on any scope. I'm not saying I will not end up simply buying another VX-3i, as I very well just might, but I need some more information be fore I do.

Keep in mind I am but scraping the tip of the adjustable scope technology ice berg, and the more I am learning what goes into making a scope like the VX-3i that is designed to be adjusted for long range shots, the more I start to understand how much more complicated and precise such an optic is VS my decades old bomb proof VX-II scopes that are by comparison dirt simple set and forget optics.

I am also learning it is very difficult some times to discern the wheat from the chaff when it comes to accurate information collected from the internet.
 
Just got a new VX6 a couple months ago. The glass is remarkably clear and I've truly tested the turrets a number of times and it's tracked perfectly every time. I honestly think the glass is substantially better than the Nightforce I replaced it with on my .280AI that is my primary hunting gun. And the significant reduction in weight is appreciated as well.

I'm curious how many of the Leupold issue threads you read were within the last 12-18 months. I've had a bunch of Leupold 'set it and forget it' type 3-9 or 3-10's on guns growing up and they've all been very reliable. I'll admit I saved up and bought a NF when I first started getting into 'long-range' shooting. Happy to now be re-thinking that need.
 
No offense taken:) Just a different point of view.
My "scientific" reference was regarding sample size. Let's say brand L sells 150,000 of a particular model and 52 people (1 in 2884) complain on the net generating some lengthy posts. Is that in indicator the brand is bad? If company B sells only 1000 of a comparable model with only 4 complaints (1 in 250) -are they better? And what if brand N and S don't even make a model remotely close in price or weight, are they even better?
I say you should have kept the Leupold and "drove it like you stole it". See for yourself and send it back if you aren't happy. If it breaks tell us how you used it and what broke.
Heck, I thought I was a serious rifle shooter until I starting reading forums like this one. Some of these guys here shoot more rounds in a week than I shoot in a year. I'm certain they have different expectations of their equipment than I do. Their opinion is very valuable, but not always applicable to my circumstances.
In other places I have read a "one star" review of Swarovski binos cuz UPS crunched the box (binos were fine). Another guy was raving on multiple forums that Cooper rifles were junk- because he had a loose guard screw on his. Then a half dozen more guys chimed in how they felt the same way- even though they never owned one...
None of us wants to get the 'lemon" so we have to try to weigh all the factors. With regard to internet complaints, I think 'percentage' of unhappy customers vs volume of complaints would be more valuable. Absent that data- then learning specifics about the failures would be helpful. You reference complaints going back a few years- but scope companies continually change models (hopefully to upgrade). If they "fixed the glitch" should I still remove them from consideration?
I know for a "hunt of a lifetime" we would all like a guarantee that we will achieve total equipment satisfaction. If a turret fails that would certainly be a deal breaker and a great warranty of little consolation. But if my OIL hunt was for sheep I'm not sure a 3 pound scope is the answer either. Looking forward to seeing which make/model you end up trying and how it suits you.
 
Heck, I thought I was a serious rifle shooter until I starting reading forums like this one. Some of these guys here shoot more rounds in a week than I shoot in a year. I'm certain they have different expectations of their equipment than I do. Their opinion is very valuable, but not always applicable to my circumstances.

Maybe a hijack here. What I discovered on the 'net is everyone but me has .2 MOA hunting rifles. Today I fired a couple three shot groups with my lightweight rifle. One was 5/8" and the other measured 3/8". The folks on the 'net wouldn't keep a rifle like this.

Now returning to your regular programming: I posted above about a Leupold that broke and was replaced with a better newer model. I didn't post about my most recent Leupold purchased a couple years ago when they first came out. A VX-6 4-24X52. The glass is definitely better than my Swarovski z5 5-25X52. Despite the Leupold weighing 24 ounces and the z5 weighing 18 ounces, if I had to keep only one it would be the VX-6. Based on hunting with both the Swarovski went back to repair twice and the Leupold never failed.
 
ok guys if you really want to see if Leupolds with turrets will hold up to zeroing up and down then go to a silhouette match and ask the competitors,I shot silhouette for about five years every week end year round and in all those years I only had one scope not repeat and had to sent back. I used VX111's 6.5-20 with target turrets and still do on all my hunting rifles and can't complain.also the one scope that was sent back on a Monday next day service and was back on Thursday morning same week when I told them I had a State match to go to. Leupold will be my only scope in fact I just bought another 6.5-20VX111i last month for a custom rifle I just had built. that is my two cents worth.gun)
 
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