Benefits of the 1/4 bore?

[Creedmoor shooter]

So this question has had me thinking for awhile. What are the benefits of the 1/4 bore over calibers say the 6mm and 6.5mm cartridges? I'm mainly wondering is there a benefit to shooting a lower bc bullet at high velocity over a higher bc bullet over a slower velocity? For example say the 243, 6.5 cm/260, 7mm-08 etc vs faster cartridges like the 25-06. Just running the numbers to me it makes no sense to shoot the 1/4 bore when it can be matched with smaller cartridges. Or even necking down a 25 cal catridge to 6mm or up to a 6.5mm will both yeild better results on paper. I'm not trying to start an arguement I'm just looking for some factual data see what I'm missing. Thanks!

 

[Mikecr]

It makes no sense to me to reference 25cal as "1/4 bore"..
All begins with a bullet, and there are not a lot of good 25cal bullets compared to 24 or 26cal.
To match your weird -> odd cals=odd bullets
And you'd find the same condition in 27cal vs 26/28cals.

 

[Creedmoor shooter]

It makes no sense to me to reference 25cal as "1/4 bore"..
All begins with a bullet, and there are not a lot of good 25cal bullets compared to 24 or 26cal.
To match your weird -> odd cals=odd bullets
And you'd find the same condition in 27cal vs 26/28cals.

Sorry I just heard people refer it to the 1/4 bore. I suppose 25 cal would be more appropriate.

I understand the bullet selection is poor. Which makes me wonder why it's even here. And I'd agree about the 27 cal til the event of the 170 berger which makes a useful spot for the 27 cal.

Some people rave about the 25 cals. 25-06 in peticular. I just want to make sure there's nothing I'm missing with the 25 cal other than just to be different.

 

[Dosh]

It makes no sense to me to reference 25cal as "1/4 bore"..
All begins with a bullet, and there are not a lot of good 25cal bullets compared to 24 or 26cal.
To match your weird -> odd cals=odd bullets
And you'd find the same condition in 27cal vs 26/28cals.

Can't fathom reason for such a slim bullet selection for the.25 caliber. I read a good number of threads here on 25-06/25-06 AI, .257 WBY and .257 Roberts which shows a large number of .25 caliber ownership. Is it the bullet manufacturers don't see a need or haven't caught up. Example, Berger offers only one .25 caliber bullet and some offer none in their premium or high BC bullet.

 

[WeiserBucks]

Nothing wrong with the .25's for normal hunting and shooting at normal ranges . Any quality bullet will take game under 300 yards , which is where most game is taken. Lack of high BC bullets has prevented them from becoming popular for long range .

 

[sambo3006]

All the factory offerings in 25 cal have 1 in 10" twist barrels. Bullet manufacturers would be catering to a very small market of custom faster twist barrel owners, hence the lack of high BC 25 cal bullets.

 

[MudRunner2005]

Can't fathom reason for such a slim bullet selection for the.25 caliber. I read a good number of threads here on 25-06/25-06 AI, .257 WBY and .257 Roberts which shows a large number of .25 caliber ownership. Is it the bullet manufacturers don't see a need or haven't caught up. Example, Berger offers only one .25 caliber bullet and some offer none in their premium or high BC bullet.

Because the big factories stopped designing .257 caliber cartridges, which in turn led to the bullet manufacturers leaving it behind. The only "why" I can't figure out, is why they originally stopped designing .257 cartridges, but they did.

I think the slow factory 1:10 twists had a lot to do with it. I think that's why a lot of people stopped using .257's...Because they could get get faster twists in other calibers, but not the .257.

Instead of them producing faster twists, they just ignored it hoping it would go away. Just like they did to the 8mm.

Personally, I love my .25-06 AI, and I'll always have one in the safe. Slinging 115 VLD's at nearly 3,400 fps MV is pretty solid.

 

[Creedmoor shooter]

Because the big factories stopped designing .257 caliber cartridges, which in turn led to the bullet manufacturers leaving it behind. The only "why" I can't figure out, is why they originally stopped designing .257 cartridges, but they did.

I think the slow factory 1:10 twists had a lot to do with it. I think that's why a lot of people stopped using .257's...Because they could get get faster twists in other calibers, but not the .257.

Instead of them producing faster twists, they just ignored it hoping it would go away. Just like they did to the 8mm.

Personally, I love my .25-06 AI, and I'll always have one in the safe. Slinging 115 VLD's at nearly 3,400 fps MV is pretty solid.

I think the 25s have a place in the hunting world. Ultra flat trajectory out to 400 yards while still maintaining a reasonable amount of energy. From what i understand they arent really that hard on barrels? Makes me wonder what a hot 25 cal would be capable of with a 130 class high bc bullet.

 

[Deleted member 46119]

The 257 Weatherby is a supreme 25 cal hunting round. Exactly as said, flat to 400. Been used as a speed goat round for a long time.

The 25-06 and variants are in there as well.

It's about what you want to do, not about the diameter of the bullet. The .257 caliber bullets should be quite lethal for deer size game and smaller. Just depends on what and how you want to take the game.

Varmints at long range. American Antelope at "moderate" ranges. Western black tails and any distance you can make the shot. White tail and Mule deer and moderate distances all seem appropriate for the .257 caliber offerings.

I have a 257 Wby but have not used it on game yet.

Choose your poison and pays you money.

 

[MudRunner2005]

I think the 25s have a place in the hunting world. Ultra flat trajectory out to 400 yards while still maintaining a reasonable amount of energy. From what i understand they arent really that hard on barrels? Makes me wonder what a hot 25 cal would be capable of with a 130 class high bc bullet.

I've said this for years, but you always just end up chasing your tail. Nobody wants to produce a cup & core VLD or Hybrid high BC .25 bullet that's actually affordable for guys like me that don't have the money to spend on lathe-cut copper monos.

The b*tch of it is, that if they did make one, it would eventually become popular, if twist rates would modernize. But nobody wants to put out the money to make that happen. The big gun manufacturers got behind and started pumping-out guns with 1:8 twists for the .26 cals, and 1:10 for the .30 cals, but not any other calibers. It's almost asinine to the consumer to have to choose between a slow twist barrel for bullets from yesteryear, or custom build a whole new rifle, just to be able to shoot modern bullets. It's like you're getting kicked in the junk regardless of which route you go.

 

[J E Custom]

So this question has had me thinking for awhile. What are the benefits of the 1/4<script id="gpt-impl-0.9072515609374958" src="https://securepubads.g.doubleclick.net/gpt/pubads_impl_111.js"></script> bore over calibers say the 6mm and 6.5mm cartridges? I'm mainly wondering is there a benefit to shooting a lower bc bullet at high velocity over a higher bc bullet over a slower velocity? For example say the 243, 6.5 cm/260, 7mm-08 etc vs faster cartridges like the 25-06. Just running the numbers to me it makes no sense to shoot the 1/4 bore when it can be matched with smaller cartridges. Or even necking down a 25 cal catridge to 6mm or up to a 6.5mm will both yeild better results on paper. I'm not trying to start an arguement I'm just looking for some factual data see what I'm missing. Thanks!

There are a lot of different reasons to choose a certain cartridge. For shooting paper, caliber/cartridge combinations don't really matter as long as the range is within reason. longer ranges need larger heavier bullets. shorter ranges can be used with almost any caliber/cartridge.

For Hunting, the rules change a bit. it is more important to have a cartridge that delivers enough energy, and can transfer that energy to the game being hunted. BCs have nothing to do with this as long as the bullet is accurate and on target. It does have a bearing on how well it performs and remains stable at the longest distances.

Velocity effects trajectory and has a bearing on bullet performance down range on game and should be a factor when choosing a cartridge for hunting. ultra high velocities can damage to much tissue and in some cases not bring the game down as well as a medium velocity cartridge of the same caliber.

So the requirements for paper are totally different than for hunting. also caliber does not dictate accuracy. Any cartridge can be made to shoot accurately. Cartridges that fill certain needs can be very accurate for those needs, just as cartridges for hunting certain game also best fill the hunters needs for that game.

Numbers (BCs, energy, Velocity)are the name of the game now days, but can mean very little in certain uses, so one has to combine and in many cases compromise everything to get the best results for the use.

Numbers, are just a good way to evaluate a cartridge so it can be chosen for the best overall performance for it's intended use and does not indicate whether it is better than another cartridge for all uses.

My recommendation is not to get caught up in the numbers game. just pick the cartridge/bullet combination that best suite's the need based on all the factors.

J E CUSTOM

 

[Creedmoor shooter]

There are a lot of different reasons to choose a certain cartridge. For shooting paper, caliber/cartridge combinations don't really matter as long as the range is within reason. longer ranges need larger heavier bullets. shorter ranges can be used with almost any caliber/cartridge.

For Hunting, the rules change a bit. it is more important to have a cartridge that delivers enough energy, and can transfer that energy to the game being hunted. BCs have nothing to do with this as long as the bullet is accurate and on target. It does have a bearing on how well it performs and remains stable at the longest distances.

Velocity effects trajectory and has a bearing on bullet performance down range on game and should be a factor when choosing a cartridge for hunting. ultra high velocities can damage to much tissue and in some cases not bring the game down as well as a medium velocity cartridge of the same caliber.

So the requirements for paper are totally different than for hunting. also caliber does not dictate accuracy. Any cartridge can be made to shoot accurately. Cartridges that fill certain needs can be very accurate for those needs, just as cartridges for hunting certain game also best fill the hunters needs for that game.

Numbers (BCs, energy, Velocity)are the name of the game now days, but can mean very little in certain uses, so one has to combine and in many cases compromise everything to get the best results for the use.

Numbers, are just a good way to evaluate a cartridge so it can be chosen for the best overall performance for it's intended use and does not indicate whether it is better than another cartridge for all uses.

My recommendation is not to get caught up in the numbers game. just pick the cartridge/bullet combination that best suite's the need based on all the factors.

J E CUSTOM

That's the kind of answer I'm looking for. Thankyou.

Would it be safe to say that from 0-400 the 25cal is a perfect mix of both speed and weight for deer to bear sized game?

 

[MudRunner2005]

That's the kind of answer I'm looking for. Thankyou.

Would it be safe to say that from 0-400 the 25cal is a perfect mix of both speed and weight for deer to bear sized game?

0-600 the .25-06 AI with a 115 VLD will have enough to drop a whitetail deer. With a 3,400 MV, I retain 2,285 FPS and 1,333 FPE at 600 yards. Pretty flat trajectory, too. From a 100 yard zero, mine only drops ~54.0" at 600 yards. So, to put that into scope clicks, I only have to dial up 8.6 MOA (40 clicks on my Zeiss 6.5-20x50) for a 600 yard shot.

 

[Creedmoor shooter]

0-600 the .25-06 AI with a 115 VLD will have enough to drop a whitetail deer. Pretty flat trajectory, too. From a 100 yard zero, mine only drops ~54.0" at 600 yards. So, to put that into scope clicks, I only have to dial up 2.5 mils (40 clicks on my Zeiss 6.5-20x50) for a 600 yard shot.

I was running 257 Weatherby/ 25-06AI numbers and out to 400 that's a hard one to beat. Past that it looks like it starts to dip off. Might be a good hunting round for my wife. Just to give her some room for error