284 Win Questions

[RidgeRebel]

Roughrice, is that a magnum (300 Win) magazine or standard (30-06)? Thanks

 

[Roughrice]

Long action to get the most out of the cartridge!
Standard "L" long action (30-06) magazine.

 

[Roughrice]

I think the magnum uses the same magazine though.

 

[Roughrice]

Build it!... it'll put a smile on your face.
I have 7 SAUM and 284 Win.
7 SAUM will outrun it by a nose but it can still go the distance and deer or elk won't know the difference which one caught up to em!
SAUM brass is hard to find and pricey when you can get it.

Now, after reading Beeman and Taylorbok post... I guess the 284 brass will be hard to find again.

 

[RidgeRebel]

It may be but I could buy up a few hundred right now and be good for years. Just to be clear, the straight 284 Lapua brass does not work well with saami chamber? I don't have the ability and don't want to get into turning necks. This will be a strict hunting rig.

 

[Roughrice]

I have a sammi chamber and the "Lapua" chamber.
I run Winchester brass, mostly because I have lots of it, and get clickers after many reloads.
I ran Lapua brass in both chambers with no-turn necks and get clickers with both after several reloads.
I run them a little hot... similar to what Jud96 is running.

 

[Roughrice]

As JD284win said...H4350 is my 180 Hybrid LR load powder and I run 2830ish fps.
I use 150, 162 and168 and they run similar velocity to his hunting loads in 26"
H4831 is a great powder as well.
I have lots of H4350 and run several different caliber rifles with it, so it works great and keeps things simple.

 

[JD284win]

JD284 Win do you have suggestion for a barrel maker? I would like to get a Tikka Prefit carbon wrapped barrel. Also, are you running your tikka as a long action?

This one is a 24" Brux #4. I have not done a carbon barrel. Carbon sendero contours are with in a few ounces of a brux 3B. Never seemed worth the money and I like heavier rifles anyway.
Chances are if you do a pre fit you'll get stuck with a SAMMI spec reamer which will be an original short action dimension from 60 years ago. I don't know what the pre fit makers do as fare as a reamer since this isn't a new fangdangled cookie cutter cartridge like the PRC's and SAUM's. I used a buddies reamer that he had custom built to his spec for the thicker lapua and norma brass.

I run mine as a long action. I spun my barrel up my self with a rem style recoil lug. So pre fit was out of the question for me.

 

[Roughrice]

This one is a 24" Brux #4. I have not done a carbon barrel. Carbon sendero contours are with in a few ounces of a brux 3B. Never seemed worth the money and I like heavier rifles anyway.
Chances are if you do a pre fit you'll get stuck with a SAMMI spec reamer which will be an original short action dimension from 60 years ago. I don't know what the pre fit makers do as fare as a reamer since this isn't a new fangdangled cookie cutter cartridge like the PRC's and SAUM's. I used a buddies reamer that he had custom built to his spec for the thicker lapua and norma brass.

I run mine as a long action. I spun my barrel up my self with a rem style recoil lug. So pre fit was out of the question for me.

My hunting rifle is a #4 Wilson 9 twist 26" that a local F/class record holding competitor and rifle builder chambered for me with a long throat. It shoots either brass wonderfully and has a cold bore consistency that is ridiculously accurate and shoots under a dime.
This one is also in a Remington LA.
My other LR rifle is actually a Criterion prefit with .220 freebore and .317 neck that can hold its own with the full customs but not with my rifle builder! Lol!
When I ran a slower powder, I didn't have quite the click problem as I had when I went with H4350 but I learned to deal with it because it printed such good groups.

I'm waiting on another Wilson 9 twist to come back from the smith to put in this Tikka action for another hunting rifle for my son.
I just made sure my longest bullet would fit…that's where the picture came from.

Whatever barrel maker you choose…build it on a long action if you want to maximize the 284 Win.

 

[Tac-O]

Maybe the lack of brass available from Lapua and Peterson will be in impetus for adg or alpha to make 284 brass. That would be nice.

 

[Roughrice]

Yep!
Good point!
I sure hope so because I really thought the 284 has had more interest than ever in the last few years with new reamers, powders and set in long actions.

 

[Roughrice]

RigdeRebel

The Tikka actions are all the same length.
If you have one that was a short action caliber, just replace the bolt stop to a long action or have it grinded down to a long actiion and get a long action magazine and you are good to go.

 

[AZShooter]

I have been shooting the 284 Win since 1986 or so. It is an amazing design considering when it was introduced back in 1963. Minimal body taper, 35-degree shoulder was way ahead of its time.

Current rifle has a 23" barrel. Custom reamer made to my specs with a 168 VLD kissing lands with OAL at 2.980". I am turning Winchester brass necks for the .315 chamber neck.

This rifle has uses two loads:

168 VLD with 52 gr RL-17 fed 210 match velocity 2925 fps

120 Nosler Ballistic Tip . 58 gr of RL-17 Fed 210 match, 3457 fps (Used same setting for seating die same as 168 VLD.)

The 120 Nosler BT is an amazing bullet. Sure, its BC is not as high as the 168 VLD but it shoots flat and penetrates well.

I suggest you give this bullet a try as well.

I have shot many coues wt with the 120 gr bullet and none ever stayed in the animal even past 400 yds.

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Thanks to gun author, Steve Timm, I will post the results he got with this bullet.

To summarize: I started using the Nosler .284" 120-grain Ballistic Tip several years ago. A friend of mine who worked at Nosler at the time told me that the bullet was a total flop with varmint hunters, but that the rifle metal silhouette shooters used a zillion of them. Nosler got complaints from the rifle silhouette shooters because the bullet was too frangible to consistently tip over the 500-meter ram. Because the rifle silhouette use was seemingly the only market for the 7-120, Nosler made the jacket considerably heavier than the original design. This change was intended to satisfy the silhouette shooters complaints, but an unintended consequence was that they unwittingly made one heck of a big game bullet. The first I heard of it was my friend at Nosler was shooting California wild boars through both shoulders (both gristle plates) with the 120 in a 7-08. Full penetration and very dead pigs!!! Please bear in mind that the silhouette story above is purely legend, but if you will split a 7-120, you will find the jacket is way heavy. Actually, it resembles the .338 BTs, which are heavy and are sure killers on larger critters. I've killed a couple of 6X6 bull elk. Not big ones, but around 290 B&C and decent bodies for five-year olds. One was shot from above, looking away at 375 yards, the bullet entered the spine behind the shoulder and was found under the hide of the chest. Expanded to .75" or so and the recovered bullet weighs about 100 grains (it's around here someplace and it's a big lead and copper ball. Second bull was 400ish. Not to be fancy, I shot the bull through the center of the shoulder. The bullet broke both shoulders and was recovered under the far hide. The bullet is identical to the first bull's bullet. Both of these were killed with the 7-08 Ackley. Other kills with the gun and bullet were a large Montana mule buck at way too close, peeking through a juniper tree at first light. Horns were big and so was he and I had to hit the only open thing I could see ... an eyeball. And I did. Bullet went clear through the head and didn't break the skull. Exited leaving a one-inch hole. Another Montana mulie was probably the largest-bodied mule I've ever shot in Montana. He was aged at 9 1/2 years in Great Falls game stop (by a PhD professor of big game). I knew the buck intimately and had not been able to kill him the three previous years. I caught him in a herd of over 100 does. Saw him at over 400 yards in the dusk and made a running open field stalk ... closed to 205 yards and shot him a little too high behind the shoulder. Spined him, dead right there, bullet fully penetrated leaving a 2" exit. There's a few more deer with the 7-08 and some antelope, but the tale is always the same. I've also used the 120 in the .280 Ackley @ 3,370 fps. Shot a moose one morning with it. Range was 91 yards and the three-year-old dumbly stood in the middle of a farm two-track. I shot him under the chin, slightly to my right, trying to break the spine upon exit. One or both carotids were broken, C-2 vertebrae was totally missing, and the bullet exited leaving a two-inch hole. For all I know, it may still be in low orbit of the earth. Mickey Moose died right there. I've shot many antelope with the bullet in the .280 Ackley. Ranges from 100 to over 500 yards. Nver missed a got with it and never shot twice. Total penetration from most any angle, except for one old and large buck that I shot fully in the chest and recovered the bullet (deadliest mushroom in the woods) right next to his bunghole. I guess you'd call it full-penetration of a goat, minus one-eighth inch. Lots of mule deer and whitetails. Normally full penetration. Don't remember ever recovering a bullet from a deer. Exits usually ran one to two inches. You ask about maximum recommended impact velocity on deer and elk. Heck I don't know, I just go out there and kill stuff. I don't know that I'd recommend it on elk of moose. I have a habit of hunting deer with the tags for big critters also in my pocket. I carry 120s and sometimes magic happens. If I was purposely hunting elk or moose only, I'd probably up-bullet to a 139 Hornady Interlocked in both the 7SGLC and the .280 Ackley. Or for really big stuff, like the Asian water buffalo I killed a couple of years ago, I used the 154 Hornady Interlocked in my .280. I severed both carotids and created a buffalo blood fountain that was quite beautiful. Anyway, I've written way too much. Use it or don't, it's not a matter of honor or pride. I use the 120 and am not prejudiced and find it kills the schit out of stuff without ruining a lot of meat. In truth, the 120 Ballistic is considerably "harder" and in my experience will out-penetrate the 140 Ballistic Tip. Those of us who love medium sized 7mm cartridges are truly blessed with a plethora of excellent big game bullets. Steve

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John Barsness (thanks for the information, John) says this:

It's one of the BT's with a VERY heavy jacket, comprising around 2/3 of the total bullet weight. Generally, these models retain at least 60% of their original weight, even if they lose the lead core. This is apparently what baffles some hunters, because they've long believed any bullet that loses won't penetrate deeply.

 

[59FLH]

1- Will I get all the benifits of a 284 Win out of 2.970 oal? that length would work with the many AI non binder plate mags I have plus would allow me to use a KRG chassis to save a little money.

No but you should get enough to make it worth the effort, considering your stated goals.

2- Can I get over 2700 FPS with 162-168 bullets with a 20-22 inch barrel? I will be running suppressed so I would really like a 20 inch barrel.

In theory, yes but you will need to load a bit past SAAMI average pressures of 55,000 psi

3- Will the 284 Win run out of AI 308 mags or do I need short mag size mags?

I'm no AI Mag expert but in my limited Win 284 experience feed lips may be an issue, I use 6.5-284 mags and WSM with success. BUT my application is NOT AI mags.