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Rifles, Reloading, Optics, Equipment
Rifles, Bullets, Barrels & Ballistics
What short action std. Bolt face caliber is most versatile?
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<blockquote data-quote="Trickymissfit" data-source="post: 989191" data-attributes="member: 25383"><p>to further add to you statement about the .308 family and machine guns. In 1937 (if memory serves me right), there was a get together with all the big time weapons manufacturers in Europe. The Mauser folks had done a bunch of research on what was going on inside the receiver during full auto fire. The Browning bunch was hung up on the 30-06, even though they knew there was a problem. The German concern figured it out, and determined that with a 500 to 650 rounds per minute cycle the max length usable (for case length) was 57mm in length. The length of the loaded round was secondary to the length of the case on extraction. The main part of the cycle was case extraction and not loading the round. There's also somekind of a ratio factor that comes to play, and it's been thirty years since I last read up on the subject. That's why most malfunctions can be traced to extraction or dirt. </p><p> </p><p>So how does the .762x51 case come into play? Well after WW2 and very early into the Korean war we knew we had a problem. The Pentagon and the GAO were into discussion about a new squad light machine gun package. There was a committee set up, and they came back with two ideas. One was a 30-06 chambered piece of junk, that was promptly discarded. The other idea was to simply copy the WW2 MG42 in .300 Savage (no .308 yet). The old WW2 generals went nuts, and would not use a German design. Awhile later (towards the end of the Korean War) the new machine gun comes up again. The Pentagon Fact Finding Board decides on the MG42 again. The same generals knock it down. About this time there was a new Winchester cartridge, copied from the new military cartridge. At 51 mm in length it was deemed ideal for case extraction. Only problem was they put in the M60 machine gun instead of copying the MG42. Most folks think the M60 is a copy, but trust me it's not.</p><p>gary</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Trickymissfit, post: 989191, member: 25383"] to further add to you statement about the .308 family and machine guns. In 1937 (if memory serves me right), there was a get together with all the big time weapons manufacturers in Europe. The Mauser folks had done a bunch of research on what was going on inside the receiver during full auto fire. The Browning bunch was hung up on the 30-06, even though they knew there was a problem. The German concern figured it out, and determined that with a 500 to 650 rounds per minute cycle the max length usable (for case length) was 57mm in length. The length of the loaded round was secondary to the length of the case on extraction. The main part of the cycle was case extraction and not loading the round. There's also somekind of a ratio factor that comes to play, and it's been thirty years since I last read up on the subject. That's why most malfunctions can be traced to extraction or dirt. So how does the .762x51 case come into play? Well after WW2 and very early into the Korean war we knew we had a problem. The Pentagon and the GAO were into discussion about a new squad light machine gun package. There was a committee set up, and they came back with two ideas. One was a 30-06 chambered piece of junk, that was promptly discarded. The other idea was to simply copy the WW2 MG42 in .300 Savage (no .308 yet). The old WW2 generals went nuts, and would not use a German design. Awhile later (towards the end of the Korean War) the new machine gun comes up again. The Pentagon Fact Finding Board decides on the MG42 again. The same generals knock it down. About this time there was a new Winchester cartridge, copied from the new military cartridge. At 51 mm in length it was deemed ideal for case extraction. Only problem was they put in the M60 machine gun instead of copying the MG42. Most folks think the M60 is a copy, but trust me it's not. gary [/QUOTE]
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Rifles, Reloading, Optics, Equipment
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What short action std. Bolt face caliber is most versatile?
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