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Rifles, Reloading, Optics, Equipment
Rifles, Bullets, Barrels & Ballistics
Nosler Accubond Long Range problem
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<blockquote data-quote="Engineering101" data-source="post: 845441" data-attributes="member: 63138"><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"><span style="font-size: 10px">After my initial post there were several questions that I will attempt to answer below. Before I do however, let me say thanks to you all for the help thinking this through. As Kirby said, this is a "learning" moment. I do like Kirby's idea of just using them at 2,950 fps but… since I've got all kinds of rifles to use and this is just a hobby for me I think I will foolishly press on and try to get to the root of this problem. </span></span></p><p> </p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"><span style="font-size: 10px">The barrels I referenced are both conventional 1 in 10 twist, 6 groove, new surplus factory Savage 26 inch stainless barrels in varmit contour that I bought off Numrich's site for $95 apiece. Obviously being the same "part number" they could have a similar defect. But I don't know what kind of defect you could put in a barrel to cause it to shoot better than MOA and then quit shooting totally at a specific velocity? I bought the second barrel because of the problems I was having with the first one.</span></span></p><p> </p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"><span style="font-size: 10px">Both barrels were shot while threaded to a Savage 12 LRP large shank target action that was a 260 Rem (HS Precision stock, aluminum bedding block). As a 260 Rem it shoots as good as I can shoot. I've got a Warne 20MOA steel rail on the action and use Burris Signature 30mm Zee rings. The barrel nut torque is around 100 ft lbs - I did not use a torque wrench. Headspace is set near minimum with Pacific Tool go/no-go gages. </span></span></p><p> </p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"><span style="font-size: 10px">By the way, if you don't torque a Savage barrel nut tight enough it will throw the first shot high and then group tight several inches lower so low barrel nut torque is a candidate for the answer to this problem as I do not have the torque as tight as factory torque which is more like 200 ft lbs. However, I do have two other Savage rifles that I swap barrels with and one of those is a 300 RUM that groups 1.25" at 200 yards with 200 grain Accubonds running 3,140 fps. That barrel on that rifle is also a 26", surplus Savage factory varmit contour stainless barrel the same as the 270 WSM barrels except it is small shank. That barrel nut has the same torque on it (as hard as I can pull) as the 270 WSM does which indicates that low barrel torque is not the issue.</span></span></p><p> </p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"><span style="font-size: 10px">The 270, 150 gr ABLR bullets visually look fine and weigh dead on or within 0.1 grain. The cases used were all Winchester virgin brass (I have 200 of them) which after neck trimming to length and inside/outside chamfering were all weight sorted in 4 boxes of 50 – typical case weight spread for 50 is about 1 grain. I use RCBS dies but neck tension is set to 0.002" with a separate expander die. Concentricity error is less than 0.002" on all rounds. Jump is 0.020".</span></span></p><p> </p><p><span style="font-family: 'Verdana'"><span style="font-size: 10px">The first barrel put 3 shots into 1.812" at 200 yards using 150 gr Sierra Game Kings at 3,000 fps. I've also used 150 gr Bergers and Ballistic Tips. I did a quick powder burn rate study using the Bergers and two shot groups at 200 yards. The groups were 0.687" at 2,912 fps, 1.312" at 2,968 fps and 0.531" at 3,019 fps which of course is the best group and is over the magic 3,000 fps. I have not however shot anything but the ABLRs in the second barrel so Kirby's suggestion of trying the Bergers again is probably the way to go. I'll give that a try and see just how fast I can get them going.</span></span></p><p> </p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Engineering101, post: 845441, member: 63138"] [FONT=Verdana][SIZE=2]After my initial post there were several questions that I will attempt to answer below. Before I do however, let me say thanks to you all for the help thinking this through. As Kirby said, this is a “learning” moment. I do like Kirby’s idea of just using them at 2,950 fps but… since I’ve got all kinds of rifles to use and this is just a hobby for me I think I will foolishly press on and try to get to the root of this problem. [/SIZE][/FONT] [FONT=Verdana][SIZE=2] [/SIZE][/FONT] [FONT=Verdana][SIZE=2]The barrels I referenced are both conventional 1 in 10 twist, 6 groove, new surplus factory Savage 26 inch stainless barrels in varmit contour that I bought off Numrich’s site for $95 apiece. Obviously being the same “part number” they could have a similar defect. But I don’t know what kind of defect you could put in a barrel to cause it to shoot better than MOA and then quit shooting totally at a specific velocity? I bought the second barrel because of the problems I was having with the first one.[/SIZE][/FONT] [FONT=Verdana][SIZE=2] [/SIZE][/FONT] [FONT=Verdana][SIZE=2]Both barrels were shot while threaded to a Savage 12 LRP large shank target action that was a 260 Rem (HS Precision stock, aluminum bedding block). As a 260 Rem it shoots as good as I can shoot. I’ve got a Warne 20MOA steel rail on the action and use Burris Signature 30mm Zee rings. The barrel nut torque is around 100 ft lbs - I did not use a torque wrench. Headspace is set near minimum with Pacific Tool go/no-go gages. [/SIZE][/FONT] [FONT=Verdana][SIZE=2] [/SIZE][/FONT] [FONT=Verdana][SIZE=2]By the way, if you don’t torque a Savage barrel nut tight enough it will throw the first shot high and then group tight several inches lower so low barrel nut torque is a candidate for the answer to this problem as I do not have the torque as tight as factory torque which is more like 200 ft lbs. However, I do have two other Savage rifles that I swap barrels with and one of those is a 300 RUM that groups 1.25” at 200 yards with 200 grain Accubonds running 3,140 fps. That barrel on that rifle is also a 26”, surplus Savage factory varmit contour stainless barrel the same as the 270 WSM barrels except it is small shank. That barrel nut has the same torque on it (as hard as I can pull) as the 270 WSM does which indicates that low barrel torque is not the issue.[/SIZE][/FONT] [FONT=Verdana][SIZE=2] [/SIZE][/FONT] [FONT=Verdana][SIZE=2]The 270, 150 gr ABLR bullets visually look fine and weigh dead on or within 0.1 grain. The cases used were all Winchester virgin brass (I have 200 of them) which after neck trimming to length and inside/outside chamfering were all weight sorted in 4 boxes of 50 – typical case weight spread for 50 is about 1 grain. I use RCBS dies but neck tension is set to 0.002” with a separate expander die. Concentricity error is less than 0.002” on all rounds. Jump is 0.020”.[/SIZE][/FONT] [FONT=Verdana][SIZE=2] [/SIZE][/FONT] [FONT=Verdana][SIZE=2]The first barrel put 3 shots into 1.812” at 200 yards using 150 gr Sierra Game Kings at 3,000 fps. I’ve also used 150 gr Bergers and Ballistic Tips. I did a quick powder burn rate study using the Bergers and two shot groups at 200 yards. The groups were 0.687” at 2,912 fps, 1.312” at 2,968 fps and 0.531” at 3,019 fps which of course is the best group and is over the magic 3,000 fps. I have not however shot anything but the ABLRs in the second barrel so Kirby’s suggestion of trying the Bergers again is probably the way to go. I’ll give that a try and see just how fast I can get them going.[/SIZE][/FONT] [FONT=Verdana][SIZE=2] [/SIZE][/FONT] [SIZE=2][/SIZE] [/QUOTE]
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Nosler Accubond Long Range problem
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