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<blockquote data-quote="Buffalobob" data-source="post: 77588" data-attributes="member: 8"><p>John M</p><p></p><p>What I know about the 308 is that it was my sniper that set the Americal Division record that day in June 1970 or 71 (memory is not always real good) with a national match M-14 and lake city match ammo. I have serched and searched the internet to verify that the shot he made is still the record but have never been able to confirm it. You have never ever seen me say anything bad about the 308. I have simply seen to many fantastic shots by some of the worlds best and I was the man standing there with the little black bar on my collar saying shoot or don't shoot.</p><p></p><p>To me the object of the forum is to share advice, information and help. Not to see how many times you can insult a persons choice of guns. Sometimes the information we have at our disposal conflicts with other peoples information. The most recent example is in Ian's thread where hydrostatic shock dose not work for me but Joe Boyd sneezes and the deer dies of fright. There are witness to all events so we are reasonably sure all events are true. But they still conflict.</p><p></p><p>I have a nice little remington 700 where everything is factory and I spent all day yesterday shooting it and as usual the gun did everything you could ask for in a 17 Rem caliber. The two Mark V's I have had experience with were sub MOA guns out of the box with factory ammo. Ruger #1's are notoriuosly finicky and are a challenge sometimes but they are so much fun to shoot that the challenge is just part of the experience. There are a lot of people here who shoot different brands and types of guns. I have never owned a Savage and a year ago would have said that I never would but so many people talk about how good they shoot that it simply must be true. I see no point in delibrately insulting one brand of gun over another.</p><p></p><p>When I posted the data on my 240 Wby at 600 yds, I had just run the numbers on the 257 Wby (DA has just posted them) and I found it amusing how much energy was out there for the 257 Wby compared to the 240 Wby. And yes I would pull the trigger at 600 yds with the 240 Wby if I had been practicing and had a decent shot, the right bullet, etc, etc. The gun was doing well at 500yds yesterday and I finally got it dialed in at 1000yds. </p><p> </p><p>Now then let me go out to talk about things I don't know anything about. The guy who sold me the F N action that I used to build the 240 WBy had a Ackly 228 that he used for hunting mule deer and the guy had some humongous racks on the wall. The guy had "peculiar" hunting techniques that worked for him. My underestanding of the 228 Ackly is that it was designed specifically to get around the restriction on 224 calibers for deer hunting. And once we get the 224 caliber deer hunters involved in this discussion we will see some strange numbers come up on what it takes to kill a deer ( I have tried that too and it does work but is not my idea of fun and fun is why I hunt).</p><p></p><p>The point of my last post was to demonstarate the differency between helping a person and insulting a person.</p><p></p><p>The purpose of this post is the same. There is a difference between insults and help. 25 years ago when I started doing this stuff there was no one to help me and I made a lot of mistakes. I still make mistakes and I expect I will continue to make mistakes. A guy gave me some advice on wind at the range yesterday and I thought he was crazy but I begin noticing as I walked from the bench out to the 1000yd targets that he was right. The flags showed a right to left wind but the wind was actually funneling straight downrange. Once I understood his help and advice things begin to go well at 1000yds. That is what the forum is about to me.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Buffalobob, post: 77588, member: 8"] John M What I know about the 308 is that it was my sniper that set the Americal Division record that day in June 1970 or 71 (memory is not always real good) with a national match M-14 and lake city match ammo. I have serched and searched the internet to verify that the shot he made is still the record but have never been able to confirm it. You have never ever seen me say anything bad about the 308. I have simply seen to many fantastic shots by some of the worlds best and I was the man standing there with the little black bar on my collar saying shoot or don't shoot. To me the object of the forum is to share advice, information and help. Not to see how many times you can insult a persons choice of guns. Sometimes the information we have at our disposal conflicts with other peoples information. The most recent example is in Ian's thread where hydrostatic shock dose not work for me but Joe Boyd sneezes and the deer dies of fright. There are witness to all events so we are reasonably sure all events are true. But they still conflict. I have a nice little remington 700 where everything is factory and I spent all day yesterday shooting it and as usual the gun did everything you could ask for in a 17 Rem caliber. The two Mark V's I have had experience with were sub MOA guns out of the box with factory ammo. Ruger #1's are notoriuosly finicky and are a challenge sometimes but they are so much fun to shoot that the challenge is just part of the experience. There are a lot of people here who shoot different brands and types of guns. I have never owned a Savage and a year ago would have said that I never would but so many people talk about how good they shoot that it simply must be true. I see no point in delibrately insulting one brand of gun over another. When I posted the data on my 240 Wby at 600 yds, I had just run the numbers on the 257 Wby (DA has just posted them) and I found it amusing how much energy was out there for the 257 Wby compared to the 240 Wby. And yes I would pull the trigger at 600 yds with the 240 Wby if I had been practicing and had a decent shot, the right bullet, etc, etc. The gun was doing well at 500yds yesterday and I finally got it dialed in at 1000yds. Now then let me go out to talk about things I don't know anything about. The guy who sold me the F N action that I used to build the 240 WBy had a Ackly 228 that he used for hunting mule deer and the guy had some humongous racks on the wall. The guy had "peculiar" hunting techniques that worked for him. My underestanding of the 228 Ackly is that it was designed specifically to get around the restriction on 224 calibers for deer hunting. And once we get the 224 caliber deer hunters involved in this discussion we will see some strange numbers come up on what it takes to kill a deer ( I have tried that too and it does work but is not my idea of fun and fun is why I hunt). The point of my last post was to demonstarate the differency between helping a person and insulting a person. The purpose of this post is the same. There is a difference between insults and help. 25 years ago when I started doing this stuff there was no one to help me and I made a lot of mistakes. I still make mistakes and I expect I will continue to make mistakes. A guy gave me some advice on wind at the range yesterday and I thought he was crazy but I begin noticing as I walked from the bench out to the 1000yd targets that he was right. The flags showed a right to left wind but the wind was actually funneling straight downrange. Once I understood his help and advice things begin to go well at 1000yds. That is what the forum is about to me. [/QUOTE]
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