Cold bore shot group vs Warm bore shot group

[CDA]

Tis no secret that the true accuracy and potential of a rifle is a CBS over a period of time in numerous conditions.

Shoot at an identicle target at the same range using your "pet load" After each shot place one target atop of the others and over time you will see the truth.

Your second and third shot are meaningless for a true CBS. Not even sure why you attempted it.

O/C there are other matters to consider, such as how was the bore prior to each shot? Dirty, cleaned and oiled? You've left to many exposed variables to have validity in your data.

Honestly, you've no business attempting a 1000 yard shot on a live animal until you've corrected numerous things.

 

[X-man]

I have a few other things you could try.

1) Eliminate the "clean" from cold clean bore and try again. You may have to adjust your cleaning technique.

2) Eliminate the bipod and the "hood of the truck" from the equation. I shoot by pushing forward on the bipod. Slippery conditions do not allow this so I suggest trying a field type of sandbag (some like plastic teddy bear fill), a backpack, or something you can consistently shoot small groups from.

You and your rifle have lots of work to do before attempting a long shot but don't feel discouraged.... shooting from an improvised field position is a real eye opener. Shooting CCB opens another dimension of variables to the equation.

Keep eliminating the variables and you will find successes.

Good luck!

 

[Alan Griffith]

X-man,

All shots from a cold barrel only; not clean.

I'll take note of the slippery surface from here on out. I do try and push forward on the Harris bipod and preload it.

At least I have another year before I have to field test any "new" results......
Exit side

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Entrance side

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It all happened so fast too. I didn't get a chance to try anything long this year. Nosler 180 AB at 2997 fps from 30-06 Ackley slipped through the right ribs and out the left rib cage from 225 yds. Went 32 yds.

Utah Spike elk shot on Saturday, 6 Oct 2007, 0848 hrs.
Elev 11,227
Baro 21.something
Temp 18 deg
wind from rear
1.5 MOA adj per my EXBAL
5" fresh snow
I was shaken like a dang leaf too!
Had him cleaned, quartered and packed back to the trail head by 4 pm with the help of my Eberlestock J107

 

[X-man]

Alan

Nice going on the Elk!

Contrary to popular belief a bipod can cause fits in the field and the only solution here is lots of practice.

One thing I almost mentioned in my last post was that it appeared (to me) that your group had a trigger related problem. Your rifle's forend appears extremely light and I am pretty sure that a heavy trigger and or trigger control is contributing to your group size. Experiment with a lighter trigger set at 4-8 Oz and see if this helps.

Rifles with very light forends tend to skate around and throw 12:00 high shots from the pressure of the trigger. Try dry firing the rifle while shooting from an improvised field position and watch the cross hairs. If the hairs move (in the slightest) you need to either lighten the trigger or go to work on a more inline and gentle trigger squeeze. Your rifle (while practical and portable) could prove difficult to master as an extreme range field rifle (as is).

Since I only have the one target to review I am taking a bit of a wild guess but, that is what your one target looks like.

Keep up the good work and good luck!

 

[CDA]

LR hunting requires a bi-pod most of the time. Why would anyone think that throwing a pill beyond 500 yards without a sturdy rest is warranted without proper support. A bi-pod is not a huge inconvenience and I believe most here would benefit from doing all their pre-season shooting from field positions and "real world" hunting situations via LR scenario's which would employ the use of a bi-pod a rear bag.

I am having a hard time seeing where a heavy trigger would make a 12 o'clock paper print? Let alone a light forend? If the rifle is properly free floated there should be little issue. However, noodle barrels are often not typically as accurate after 3 or more shots. Yes, I agree, a heavy trigger does not usually equal a tight group or even a tiny group.

The rifle is question doesn't yield normal visions of a LR set up. Throw a #5, #6 or so barrel on there with some good bedding a free floating and now you've got something.

 

[Charles A]

Most would probably be better served using a pack instead of a bipod. I have watched quite a few people shoot significantly better after ditching the bipod.

 

[Mikecr]

Charles, I've seen just the opposite.
3 of my hunting guns shoot better off a bipod than a Farley rest with edgewood bags.

You wouldn't think so, but some rifles are very sensitive to contact point. POI can vary wildly if not just a certain way.

I found that a Harris bipod offers some advantages for round or small forearmed stocks:
It's pressure point is precisely at the same place. This is vital for developing cold barrel consisency that will be needed in the field.
It's also easier to lock in level for the rifle prior to taking shots off a Harris swivel model than it is with any other rest. Do not under estimate the importance of level. Don't think you can simply judge it while aiming. You can't.
Finally, if preloaded a Harris helps control torque.

 

[Charles A]

Mike the problem IS torque. A bipod will not, can not, "bounce" the same way off of different surfaces. The more the gun recoils the worse the torque is. Bipods can, and are, used to great affect all the time, but the "harmonics" will be more consistent off a bag or pack. If a gun is having such consistency problems depending on where it's placed in the bags, theres a problem.

Regardless, one's concepts are dependent on there situation and experiences. If the bipods are working for you, stay with it. Where I work there is an increasing trend to dump the bipod... Depending.

 

[edge]

I have added a second sling stud for use with a bi-pod. It is just in front of the recoil lug. I admit that it reduces the length of the rifle/ shooter, but since I use a synthetic stock that may bounce I think that it is a very good trade-off.

edge.

 

[X-man]

Mike the problem IS torque. A bipod will not, can not, "bounce" the same way off of different surfaces. The more the gun recoils the worse the torque is. Bipods can, and are, used to great affect all the time, but the "harmonics" will be more consistent off a bag or pack. If a gun is having such consistency problems depending on where it's placed in the bags, theres a problem.

Regardless, one's concepts are dependent on there situation and experiences. If the bipods are working for you, stay with it. Where I work there is an increasing trend to dump the bipod... Depending.

Like Charles says I am not blaming the bipod nor certainly am I suggesting Alan G get rid of his bipod. I am simply suggesting the elimination of some potential variables in Alan's quest to become a more effective field shooter.
When things come back together variables can be added one at a time.

Whan all else fails....drop back and punt!

Works for me.

 

[ogreshooter]

YouTube - Recoil Management, *Bipods Don't Hop*

Loading the bipod. Titles "Bipods dont Hop".

Have a look. Seems to me that even with the big guns (it even says it in one of these videos) that the 300WSM can be held on target at 100 yards.

Bipods are not as bad as people think. What is important is that no matter what you plan on hunting with, PRACTICE. Not just blow rounds down range. Perfect practice makes perfect. Treat every bullet like it is the last one on earth.

That said, no matter how you practice, use in practice what you are going to take to the field. If you dont plan on packing a 25 pound sand bag, dont shoot off of one in practice. If you plan on shooting off of a back pack with 3 days of food, you had better be practicing shooting off of that.