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Rifles, Reloading, Optics, Equipment
Rifles, Bullets, Barrels & Ballistics
Bullet Expansion - Hammer Hunter vs HHT
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<blockquote data-quote="Petey308" data-source="post: 2954005" data-attributes="member: 106845"><p>I've shot at least hundreds of SST, AMAX, VMAX, SMKs, Bergers, ELDM, ELDX, Nosler Ballistic Tips, Sierra BlitzKings, TMKs, GameKings, Barnes varieties, etc. And even in the thousands of a few of those. Others not mentioned are not in the hundreds or more, but I have a fair experience still with many others. I've shot on a lot of rolling hills farm ground and through/over terraces and through lots of grass, brush, etc.</p><p>I was born and raised on a farm and had lots of opportunities. I started reloading with my grandpa and dad when I was around 9 and making my own by middle school, unsupervised. The farm life and now military life have been hard on my body too, so I can relate with you there. The military life has caused me to not shoot and hunt as much as I used to, but it hasn't taken away all the past experiences and I still get in my fair share now. I only have a few years to go and I'll be retired (takes longer not being active duty anymore), then I can really get back to business doing just the fun stuff lol.</p><p></p><p>Anyway, I did say I have had a few issues over the years, but the repeats were most common with the open tip bullets and not so much the tipped ones I used. There's a reason I pretty much only use tipped bullets nowadays. It's not just to help protect the cavity either.</p><p></p><p>Call BS all you want. I know what I experienced lol.</p><p></p><p>I also know buffalo horns are not like trees lol. I never said they were. I only brought up that story because it's a time a Hammer specifically hit something substantial before tissue and the final outcome was still good, or so I recall from the story. You can clarify that, and when I made that original comment on it I figured you would, but you seem to have misinterpreted the point I was making on it. My point was not always when Hammers hit something first does it mean it won't still work well. That was an example that popped in my head first. I've seen a lot of guys big on Hammers quick to blame hitting something along the way as if it'll always result in a poor result, but there's an extreme example of a time it didn't seem to matter. I'm sure there are others that have hit things too and probably didn't even know it because the outcome was still good. Can it happen? Absolutely, and it may very well have for the OP, but it's not a given either.</p><p></p><p>I have not once made comments in this thread in an effort to bash Hammer. I have only stated my opinions based on what I know already. If anything otherwise has been concluded from that, it's from reading too far into it and it's based on false pretenses. I'm just here discussing and making observations.</p><p></p><p>Steve himself said the new tipped versions help:</p><p></p><p>So to me, that translates to the HH line is susceptible to being damaged before impact and it can cause results like this. So that would mean nothing I've said so far is a flat out lie, right? It only backs up what I've said, right? Perhaps you just didn't like me saying it? I didn't say something like, "this happens all the time to Hammers because it's a crap design and you shouldn't use them ever". I mentioned how and why it could happen and that I've seen a few other instances now where it's happened, to include experiences of my own even with other bullets.</p><p></p><p>You have rambled on and said mostly nothing but people need to clear their minds and not jump to conclusions. I agree with that. You also said we learn more from failures and when things don't go so right. I agree there too, and it's why I like to be involved in discussions like this and it's why I'm here. So take my comments as that, because that's all they are. And please don't take offense here. I say you rambled on mostly in jest because you yourself call yourself out on that in many of your posts lol. I just didn't get much more out of this particular response is all, although there was maybe some potential.</p><p></p><p></p><p>Not sure what you're wanting me to answer here. I was hand loading by myself in 1997 and out there in the fields shooting coyotes, raccoons, opossums, rabbits, and lots of targets (could only shoot deer with shotguns and slugs).</p><p></p><p>Not sure what I need to talk to Mark about either. I'm not here trying to call you out, so I'm not sure what this is about.</p><p></p><p>Let's move on now, shall we? Focus on bullets and learn more about them and terminal ballistics…. Figure out what there is to figure out with things like in the OP and use that to build on our wisdom and equip us for more success out there. So please, there's no reason to respond to this any further and drag anything out that's not going to help the OP. </p><p></p><p>Happy Thanksgiving to all celebrating!</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="Petey308, post: 2954005, member: 106845"] I've shot at least hundreds of SST, AMAX, VMAX, SMKs, Bergers, ELDM, ELDX, Nosler Ballistic Tips, Sierra BlitzKings, TMKs, GameKings, Barnes varieties, etc. And even in the thousands of a few of those. Others not mentioned are not in the hundreds or more, but I have a fair experience still with many others. I've shot on a lot of rolling hills farm ground and through/over terraces and through lots of grass, brush, etc. I was born and raised on a farm and had lots of opportunities. I started reloading with my grandpa and dad when I was around 9 and making my own by middle school, unsupervised. The farm life and now military life have been hard on my body too, so I can relate with you there. The military life has caused me to not shoot and hunt as much as I used to, but it hasn't taken away all the past experiences and I still get in my fair share now. I only have a few years to go and I'll be retired (takes longer not being active duty anymore), then I can really get back to business doing just the fun stuff lol. Anyway, I did say I have had a few issues over the years, but the repeats were most common with the open tip bullets and not so much the tipped ones I used. There's a reason I pretty much only use tipped bullets nowadays. It's not just to help protect the cavity either. Call BS all you want. I know what I experienced lol. I also know buffalo horns are not like trees lol. I never said they were. I only brought up that story because it's a time a Hammer specifically hit something substantial before tissue and the final outcome was still good, or so I recall from the story. You can clarify that, and when I made that original comment on it I figured you would, but you seem to have misinterpreted the point I was making on it. My point was not always when Hammers hit something first does it mean it won't still work well. That was an example that popped in my head first. I've seen a lot of guys big on Hammers quick to blame hitting something along the way as if it'll always result in a poor result, but there's an extreme example of a time it didn't seem to matter. I'm sure there are others that have hit things too and probably didn't even know it because the outcome was still good. Can it happen? Absolutely, and it may very well have for the OP, but it's not a given either. I have not once made comments in this thread in an effort to bash Hammer. I have only stated my opinions based on what I know already. If anything otherwise has been concluded from that, it's from reading too far into it and it's based on false pretenses. I'm just here discussing and making observations. Steve himself said the new tipped versions help: So to me, that translates to the HH line is susceptible to being damaged before impact and it can cause results like this. So that would mean nothing I've said so far is a flat out lie, right? It only backs up what I've said, right? Perhaps you just didn't like me saying it? I didn't say something like, "this happens all the time to Hammers because it's a crap design and you shouldn't use them ever". I mentioned how and why it could happen and that I've seen a few other instances now where it's happened, to include experiences of my own even with other bullets. You have rambled on and said mostly nothing but people need to clear their minds and not jump to conclusions. I agree with that. You also said we learn more from failures and when things don't go so right. I agree there too, and it's why I like to be involved in discussions like this and it's why I'm here. So take my comments as that, because that's all they are. And please don't take offense here. I say you rambled on mostly in jest because you yourself call yourself out on that in many of your posts lol. I just didn't get much more out of this particular response is all, although there was maybe some potential. Not sure what you're wanting me to answer here. I was hand loading by myself in 1997 and out there in the fields shooting coyotes, raccoons, opossums, rabbits, and lots of targets (could only shoot deer with shotguns and slugs). Not sure what I need to talk to Mark about either. I'm not here trying to call you out, so I'm not sure what this is about. Let's move on now, shall we? Focus on bullets and learn more about them and terminal ballistics…. Figure out what there is to figure out with things like in the OP and use that to build on our wisdom and equip us for more success out there. So please, there’s no reason to respond to this any further and drag anything out that’s not going to help the OP. Happy Thanksgiving to all celebrating! [/QUOTE]
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Bullet Expansion - Hammer Hunter vs HHT
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