Forums
New posts
Search forums
What's new
Articles
Latest reviews
Author list
Classifieds
Log in
Register
What's new
Search
Search
Search titles and first posts only
Search titles only
By:
New posts
Search forums
Menu
Log in
Register
Install the app
Install
Forums
Hunting
Elk Hunting
Berger VLD pencil through Elk in Cold?
JavaScript is disabled. For a better experience, please enable JavaScript in your browser before proceeding.
You are using an out of date browser. It may not display this or other websites correctly.
You should upgrade or use an
alternative browser
.
Reply to thread
Message
<blockquote data-quote="bigngreen" data-source="post: 2695972" data-attributes="member: 13632"><p>Here the issue with penciling and plugged tips, I've tried to make a normal Berger pulled out of the box and found with a shallow hole and shot it into an elk, repeatedly and never had one not open normally. Many years ago, before closed tips became a thing no one sorted and had 100% success. The very first bit of info that came to my knowledge about the plugged tip was when we ran a comparison of the nose cavity depth between a bunch of OTM type bullets. After talking with some manufacturers it was narrowed down to the punch pin catching some material from the nose. One of my favorite bullets, more consistent than the Berger but the same jacket had a super small meplat and was lead to the tip, essentially plugged and it opened so beautiful and consistent out to 1000 on elk it was epic.</p><p>The most I've ever done is maybe blow on some tips and make sure they whistle, in hundreds of animals 95% have been unsorted, my dad has to customize each bullet, trim, drill, cone and we have the same success rate.</p><p>I have not seen proof that some material in the nose stopped expansion cold at a rate you can point and say found it. Is it a suspect, sure, right up there with banging in the mag or being dropped, hang nail meplats, it's something we can explain some occasional pencil.</p><p>Blowing up is a whole other dynamic, this there is some pretty solid testing done to the point I'd say if you blow one up the jacket was stressed for some reason, we've been able to actually test and predict the out come.</p><p>Then you sometimes just have weird crap happen, I can accept a percentage of that but if some things is consistent as what has been presented by some it should be no issue to duplicate if it's a design or QC issue not an issue in another interacting component like a barrel bore. I've been able to to exactly that with a number of bullets to help advance the design or just drop them off my list, I started out very antagonistic with Bergers, it took a LOT of consistence over two years of high volume killing for me to carry just them and not also have a backup loaded and ready!</p><p>I've gone so far as to load the Berger varmint bullets in to 22-250's at 3500 fps and go shoot deer and antelope from 65 yards out to 600+, the closer hit was right through the center of an antelope bucks shoulder, it was the only one out of 20+ animals to not exit but it made the far side. I've put 140's through bulls shoulders, a friend reamed an Alaskan bull moose from the front and we found the bullet back in the flank. I've seen a lot of Berger 300 gr bullets plow though elk, we have never caught one, tried to pencil them, 1200 yards on antelope, they opened.</p><p></p><p>There are just some guys I think that shouldn't shoot some bullets at some animals, I can't explain it, maybe it's something in their process or just dumb luck but when you have a HUGE body of evidence to the contrary it maybe a personal issue. I have a personal issue with some bullets, I think it's just my placement or terrain and maybe I just won't align my process to make them shine. That's OK, plenty of bullets out there for everyone. I don't shoot a lot of Bergers because they fail me I shoot them because they are better than what I shot before, I'm usually really quick to test any new hunting bullet, if it does something the same or better than the bullet before I keep shooting it, don't care about brand just performance.</p></blockquote><p></p>
[QUOTE="bigngreen, post: 2695972, member: 13632"] Here the issue with penciling and plugged tips, I've tried to make a normal Berger pulled out of the box and found with a shallow hole and shot it into an elk, repeatedly and never had one not open normally. Many years ago, before closed tips became a thing no one sorted and had 100% success. The very first bit of info that came to my knowledge about the plugged tip was when we ran a comparison of the nose cavity depth between a bunch of OTM type bullets. After talking with some manufacturers it was narrowed down to the punch pin catching some material from the nose. One of my favorite bullets, more consistent than the Berger but the same jacket had a super small meplat and was lead to the tip, essentially plugged and it opened so beautiful and consistent out to 1000 on elk it was epic. The most I've ever done is maybe blow on some tips and make sure they whistle, in hundreds of animals 95% have been unsorted, my dad has to customize each bullet, trim, drill, cone and we have the same success rate. I have not seen proof that some material in the nose stopped expansion cold at a rate you can point and say found it. Is it a suspect, sure, right up there with banging in the mag or being dropped, hang nail meplats, it's something we can explain some occasional pencil. Blowing up is a whole other dynamic, this there is some pretty solid testing done to the point I'd say if you blow one up the jacket was stressed for some reason, we've been able to actually test and predict the out come. Then you sometimes just have weird crap happen, I can accept a percentage of that but if some things is consistent as what has been presented by some it should be no issue to duplicate if it's a design or QC issue not an issue in another interacting component like a barrel bore. I've been able to to exactly that with a number of bullets to help advance the design or just drop them off my list, I started out very antagonistic with Bergers, it took a LOT of consistence over two years of high volume killing for me to carry just them and not also have a backup loaded and ready! I've gone so far as to load the Berger varmint bullets in to 22-250's at 3500 fps and go shoot deer and antelope from 65 yards out to 600+, the closer hit was right through the center of an antelope bucks shoulder, it was the only one out of 20+ animals to not exit but it made the far side. I've put 140's through bulls shoulders, a friend reamed an Alaskan bull moose from the front and we found the bullet back in the flank. I've seen a lot of Berger 300 gr bullets plow though elk, we have never caught one, tried to pencil them, 1200 yards on antelope, they opened. There are just some guys I think that shouldn't shoot some bullets at some animals, I can't explain it, maybe it's something in their process or just dumb luck but when you have a HUGE body of evidence to the contrary it maybe a personal issue. I have a personal issue with some bullets, I think it's just my placement or terrain and maybe I just won't align my process to make them shine. That's OK, plenty of bullets out there for everyone. I don't shoot a lot of Bergers because they fail me I shoot them because they are better than what I shot before, I'm usually really quick to test any new hunting bullet, if it does something the same or better than the bullet before I keep shooting it, don't care about brand just performance. [/QUOTE]
Insert quotes…
Verification
Post reply
Forums
Hunting
Elk Hunting
Berger VLD pencil through Elk in Cold?
Top